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Unread postby rcsha » Thu May 01, 2003 11:34 pm

Zhugeliang wrote:jiuwan give me the bio in chinese even if i don't know how to read in chinese my mom does. can u tell me what Pang De did in wei.


I think it was either Pang Shiyuan or Jiuwan that posted Pang De's SGZ bio a few pages back, it was like 20 or such.

His major accomplishment is basically defeating and nearly capturing Guan Yu in a duel. After that he was captured while bravely fighting against the Shu boats at Fan Cheng and executed by Guan Yu.
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Unread postby Yu Angel » Fri May 02, 2003 12:17 am

.... aye
how do say xiahou dun?

gi a hoe dune?
zha hoe dune?

or is the first name a dun instead of a dune?
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Unread postby rcsha » Fri May 02, 2003 12:26 am

Cao Hong wrote:How come in DW3 Sun Ce was only in two battles?


Because he only fought in a few historically, he fought in roughly 4 or 5 battle and 3 of them were condensed into a single battle, hence the issue, heh.

Yu Angel wrote:.... aye
how do say xiahou dun?

gi a hoe dune?
zha hoe dune?

or is the first name a dun instead of a dune?


<Shrugs>I'm not entirely sure but I pronounce it as thus:
Z-aye Ah Hoo Dun

In the original DW the anouncer pronounced it like this: Show Hoo Tun, so it might be Zao Hoo Dun, with a silent 'I'.
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Unread postby jiuwan » Fri May 02, 2003 12:41 am

Pang Shiyuan wrote:Just a side question, jiuwan...is it true that the imperial seal was made out of the famous Heshi Jade?


Well I can't remember exactly where I read it. But I believe it so. So if anyone can confirm this for me, or dispute it then go ahead. Or else what I write in the following paragraphs will be for nought.

This is all I know about the He Shi Jade, and imperial seals. Here goes...

<i>Seals were used throughout China's history. It was recorded to be in use in the Spring and Autumn period (722 - 481 BC). According to Han dynasty story, the first seal was given to the Yellow Emperor by a yellow dragon with a chart on it's back. Another story was that the emperor Yao received the seal from a phoenix as the emperor was sitting in a boat. No matter which one is right, the seal signifies the Mandate of Heaven. Who ever has it has the rights to rule the empire. There were to names for the seals - xi and bao. It was originally xi for both official and private seals. According to history, Empress Wu of the Tang dynasty (634-705AD) changed it to 'bao' because she dislike the sound of 'xi' - it sounded to much like 'si' (death). When the emperor Zhong Zong resumed his throne in 705 AD, he changed the name back. Subsequently the names for the seal was alternated depending on the period of time. In the Han dynasty the emperor had six seals, as time passed it increased. By the time of the Qing dynasty the emperor had several dozens of official imperial seals. One of the types of imperial seals was for the indication of the emperor's own handwriting.

The 'Heshi jade' was discovered by Bian He, a man of Chu. He had discovered a big piece of uncut jade in the mountains. He offered it to the King. King Li, was greatly pleased by it, and immediately sent for a jade craftsmen. Upon examination by the craftsmen, the jade was declared "Just an ordinary stone". This greatly angered the king who ordered the guards to cut off one of Bian He's legs as punishment. Shortly afterwards, King Li passed away. King Wu succeeded to the crown. With eagerness Bian He tried his luck with the new king hoping this new king would be wiser. Alas, poor Bian He! King Wu wasn't able to distinguish the treasure within this jade, and ordered the other leg to be cut off.
Time passed on, and soon enough King Wu died as well. King Wen then rose assume power. With the uncut jade in his hands, Bian He crawled all the way to the foot of Mount Jing, where he cried bitterly for three days and three nights. King Wen heard of this story and was moved by sympathy for this legless man. King Wen then ordered the investigation into the cause of Bian He's grief. The investigation was reported to the King. Bian He was in tears not because of the loss of both his legs, but instead of the wrongs done to him. His loyalty and devotion was taken as cheating when he offered the jade to the previous two kings. The king had the craftsman carefully polish and carve the stone. As it turned out, Bian He was right all along. It was indeed a truly beautiful piece of jade, rarely seen in the world. The king then named the jade after Bian He, it became the He Shi Jade.
The imperial seals used by subsequent emperors was made from this jade.</i>
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Unread postby jiuwan » Fri May 02, 2003 12:53 am

Zhugeliang wrote:jiuwan give me the bio in chinese even if i don't know how to read in chinese my mom does. can u tell me what Pang De did in wei.


Here's Hua Tuo's bio:

華佗字元化,沛國譙人也。一名旉。游學徐土,兼通數經。沛相陳珪舉孝廉,太尉黃琬辟,皆不就。曉養性之術,時人以為年且百歲而貌有壯容。又精方藥,其療疾,合湯不過數种,心解分劑,不复稱量,煮熟便飲,語其節度,舍去輒愈。若當灸,不過一兩處,每處不過七八壯,病亦應除。若當針,亦不過一兩處,下針言 "當引某許,若至,語人." 病者言已到,應便拔針,病亦行差。若病結積在內,針藥所不能及,當須刳割者,便飲其麻沸散,須臾便如醉死無所知,因破取。病若在腸中,便斷腸湔洗,縫腹膏摩,四五日差,不痛。人亦不自寤,一月之間,即平复矣。
故甘陵相夫人有娠六月,腹痛不安,佗視脈曰:"胎已死矣." 使人手摸知所在,
在左則男,在右則女。人云:"在左,于是為湯下之,果下男形,即愈。縣吏尹世苦四支煩." 口中干,不欲聞人聲,小便不利。佗曰: "試作熱食,得汗則愈,不汗,后三日死." 即作熱食而不汗出。佗曰:"藏气已絕于內,當啼泣而絕." 果如佗言。府吏儿尋、李延共止,俱頭痛身熱,所苦正同。佗曰:"尋當下之,延當發汗." 或難其异,佗曰:"尋外實,延內實,故治之宜殊." 即各与藥,明旦并起。鹽瀆嚴昕与數人共候佗,适至,佗謂昕曰:"君身中佳否?" 昕曰:"自如常." 佗曰:"君有急病見于面,莫多飲酒." 坐畢歸。行數里,昕卒頭眩墮車,人扶將還,載歸家,中宿死。
故督郵頓子獻得病己差,詣佗視脈曰:"尚虛,未得复,勿為勞事,御內即死。臨死,當吐舌數寸." 其妻聞其病除,從百余里來省之。止宿交接,中間三日發病,一如佗言。督郵徐毅得病,佗往省之,毅謂佗曰:"昨使醫曹吏劉租針胃管訖,便苦咳嗽,欲臥不安." 佗曰:"刺不得胃管,誤中肝也,食當日減,五日不救." 遂如佗言。
東陽陳叔山小男二歲得疾,下利常先啼,日以羸困。問佗,佗曰:"其母怀軀,陽气內養,乳中虛冷,儿得母寒,故令不時愈." 佗与四物女宛丸,十日即除。
彭城夫人夜之廁。蠆螫其手,呻呼無賴。佗令溫湯近熱,漬手其中,卒可得寐,但旁人數為易湯,湯令暖之,其旦即愈。
軍吏梅平得病,除名還家,家居廣陵,未至二百里,止親人舍。有頃,佗偶至主人許,主人令佗視平,佗謂平曰:"君早見我,可不至此。今疾已結,促去可得与家相見,五日卒." 應時歸,如佗所刻。
佗行道,見一人病咽塞,嗜食而不得下,家人車載欲往就醫。佗聞其呻吟,駐車往視,語之曰:"向來道邊有賣餅家蒜齏大酢,從取三升飲之,病自當去." 即如佗言,立吐蛇—校,縣車邊,欲造佗。佗尚未還,小儿戲門前,逆見,自相謂曰:"似逢我公,車邊病是也." 疾者前入坐,見佗北壁縣此蛇輩約以十數。
又有一郡守病,佗以為其人盛怒則差,乃多受其貨而不加治,無何棄去,留書罵之。郡守果大怒,令人迫捉殺佗。郡守子知之,屬使勿逐。守瞋恚既甚,吐黑血數升而愈。又有一士大夫不快。佗云:"君病深。當破腹取。然君壽亦不過十年,病不能殺君,忍病十歲,壽懼當盡,不足故自刳裂." 士大夫不耐痛痒,必欲除之。佗遂下手,所患尋差,十年竟死。
廣陵太守陳登得病,胸中煩懣,面赤不食。佗脈之,曰:"府君胃中有虫數升,欲成內疽,食腥物所為也." 即作湯二升,先服一升,斯須盡服之。食頃,吐出三升許虫,赤頭皆動,半身是生魚膾也,所苦便愈。佗曰:"此病后三期當發,遇良醫乃可濟救." 依期果發動,時佗不在,如言而死。太祖聞而召佗,佗常在左右。太祖苦頭風,每發,心亂目眩,佗針鬲,隨手而差。
李將軍妻病甚,呼佗視脈曰:"傷娠而胎不去." 將軍言:"(聞)[間]實傷娠,
胎已去矣." 佗曰:"案脈,胎未去也." 將軍以為不然。佗舍去,婦稍小差。百余日
复動,更呼佗。佗曰:"此脈故事有胎。前當生兩儿,一儿先出,血出甚多,后儿不及生。母不自覺,旁人亦不寤,不复迎,遂不得生。胎死,血脈不复歸,必燥著母脊。故使多脊痛。今當与湯,并針一處,此死胎必出." 湯針既加,婦痛急如欲生者。佗曰:"此死胎久枯,不能自出,宜使人探之." 果得一死男,手足完具,色黑,長可尺所。
佗之絕技,凡此類也。然本作士人,以醫見業,意常自悔,后太祖親理,得病篙篤,使佗專視。佗曰:"此近難濟,恒事攻治,可延歲月." 佗久遠家思歸,因曰:"當得家書,方欲暫還耳." 到家,辭以妻病,數乞期不反。太祖累書呼,又敕郡縣發遣。佗恃能厭食事,猶不上道。太祖大怒,使人往檢,若妻信病,賜小豆四十斛,寬假限日。若其虛詐,便收送之。于是傳付許獄,考驗首服。荀彧請曰:"佗術實工,人命所縣,宜含宥之." 太祖曰:"不懮,天下當無此鼠輩耶?" 遂考竟佗。佗臨死,出一卷書与獄吏,曰:"此可以活人." 吏畏法不受,佗亦不強,索火燒之。佗死后,太祖頭風未除。太祖曰:"佗能愈此。小人養吾病,欲以自重,然吾不殺此子,亦終當不為我斷此根原耳." 及后愛子倉舒病因,太祖嘆曰:"吾侮殺華佗,令此儿強死也."
初,軍吏李成苦咳嗽,晝夜不寤,時吐膿血,以問佗。佗言:"君病腸臃,咳之所吐,非從肺來也。与君散兩錢,當吐二升余膿血訖,快自養,一月可小起,好自將愛,一年便健。十八歲當一小發,服此散,亦行复差。若不得此藥,故當死." 复与兩錢散。成得藥,去五六歲,親中人有病如成者。謂成曰:"卿今強健,我欲死,何忍無急去藥,以待不樣?" 先持貸我,我差,為卿從華佗更索." 成与之。已故到譙,适值佗見收,匆匆不忍從求。后十八歲,成病竟發,無藥可服,以至于死。廣陵吳普、彭城樊阿皆從佗學。普依准佗治,多所全濟。佗語普曰:"人體欲得勞動,但不當使極爾。動搖則谷气得消,血脈流通,病不得生,譬猶戶樞不朽是也。是以古之仙者為導引之事,熊頸鴟顧,引輓腰體,動諸關節,以求難老。吾有一術,名五禽之戲,一曰虎,二曰鹿,三曰熊,四曰猿,五曰鳥,亦以除疾,并利蹄足,以當導引。體中不快,起作一禽之戲,沾濡汗出,因上著粉,身體輕便,腹中欲食." 普施行之,年九十余,耳目聰明,齒牙完堅。阿善針術。凡醫咸言背及胸藏之間不可妄針,針之不過四分,而阿針背入一二寸,巨闕胸藏針下五六寸,而病輒皆瘳。阿從佗求可服食益于人者,佗授以漆葉青黏散。漆時屑一升,青粘屑十四兩,以是為率,盲久服去三虫,利五藏,輕體,使人頭于白。阿從其言,壽百余歲。漆葉處所而有,青黏生于丰、沛、彭城及朝歌云。


And here's Pang De's bio:

龐德字令明,南安狟道人也。少為郡吏、州從事。初平中,從馬騰擊反羌叛氐,數有功,稍遷至校尉。建安中,太祖討袁譚、尚于黎陽,譚遣郭援、高干等略取河東,太祖使鐘繇率關中諸將討之。德隨騰子超拒援、干于平陽,德為軍鋒,進攻援、干,大破之,親斬援首。拜中郎將,封都亭侯。后張白騎叛于弘農,德复隨騰征之,破自騎于兩殽間。每戰,常陷陳卻敵,勇冠騰軍。后騰征為衛尉,德留屬超。太祖破超于渭南,德隨超亡入漢陽,保冀城。后复隨超奔漢中,從張魯。太祖定漢中,德隨眾降。太祖素聞其驍勇,拜立義將軍,封關門亭侯,邑三戶。
侯音、衛開等以宛叛,德將所領与曹仁共攻拔宛,斬音、開,遂南屯樊,討關羽。樊下諸將以德兄在漢中,頗疑之。德常曰:我受國恩,義在效死。我欲身自擊羽。今年我不殺羽。羽當殺我。后親与羽交戰,射羽中額。時德常乘白馬,羽軍謂之白馬將軍,皆憚之。仁使德屯樊北十里,會天霖雨十余日,漢水暴溢,樊下平地五六丈,德与諸將避水上堤。羽乘船攻之,以大船四面射堤上。德被甲持弓,箭不虛發。將軍董衡、部典將董超等欲降,德皆收斬之。自平旦力戰至日過中,羽攻益急,矢盡,短兵接戰。
德謂督將成何曰:吾聞良將不怯死以苟免,烈士不毀節以求生。今日,我死日也。
戰益怒,气愈壯,而水浸盛,吏士皆降。德与麾下將一人,五伯二人,彎弓傅矢,乘小船欲還仁營。水盛船覆,失弓矢,獨抱船覆水中,為羽所得,立而不跪。羽謂曰:卿兄在漢中,我欲以卿為將,不早降何為焉?德罵羽曰:堅子,何謂降也!魏王帶甲百万,威振天下。汝劉備庸才耳,豈能敵邪?我宁為國家鬼,不為賊將也。遂為羽所殺。太祖聞而悲之,為之流涕,封其二子為列侯。文帝即王位,乃遣使就德墓賜謚,策曰:昔先軫喪元,王蠋絕脰,隕身徇節,前代美之。惟侯戎昭果毅,蹈難成名,聲溢當時,義高在昔,寡人愍焉,謚曰壯侯。又賜子會等四人爵關內侯,邑各百戶。會勇烈有父風,官至中衛將軍,封列侯。
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Unread postby jiuwan » Fri May 02, 2003 1:00 am

rcsha wrote:I think it was either Pang Shiyuan or Jiuwan that posted Pang De's SGZ bio a few pages back, it was like 20 or such.


That would be me. Guilty as charged. :lol:

But I didn't do the whole translation for Pang De. I just summarized it and translated some excerpts. And it was on page 19 for anyone that wants to read it.

Yu Angel wrote:how do say xiahou dun?


This is how you pronounce it:

Cantonese - Ha Hou Dun

Mandarin - Sha Hou Dun

I know those aren't the correct pinyin (mandarin) but that's what it sounds like when you try to pronounce it. It's nothing like what Koei made it sound like. E.g. Kessen II - "Gee Ah Hou Dun" :lol: That pronouncation always cracks me up!
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Unread postby Pang Shiyuan » Fri May 02, 2003 12:31 pm

If i may add...

There are other stories concerning the Heshi Jade...

Su Qin and Zhang Yi, both famous for their legendary political and diplomatic skills sought instruction from the famous Gui Gu Zi (real name, Wang Xu) in the art of political lobbying. After they had finished their training, Gui Gu Zi passed on the collective work of the Marquis Jiang Ziya, titled Yin Fu Pian to Su and Zhang, with the parting advice that should any of them fall into hard times, they should turn to the manuscript.

Su Qin subsequently went to Zhao, where after untold hardship, managed to impress the King with his talents and was appointed as its Prime Minister. Zhang Yi, however was not so lucky. In order to gain status in the state of Chu in the hope of gaining an official post, Zhang resorted to becoming a hanger-on to the Chu prime minister Zhao Xiang.

One day, Zhao Xiang acquired the He Shi jade and wanted to show it off to his colleagues by throwing a feast to showcase his newfound treasure. At the end of the feast, Zhao Xiang saw his guests home, but upon inspection, found out that the He Shi Jade was missing. Some jealous fellow hanger ons of Zhang Yi voiced out their suspicions that Zhang was the thief, since he was a poor man. Zhao Xiang was enraged and tortured Zhang until he was half-dead to extract a confession.

Zhang Yi was later brought home to his grief stricken family, who tended his wounds. At night, his wife advised him not to pursue such ambitious dreams such as his of obtaining political power. Zhang then asked his wife if his tongue was still there. Smiling through her tears, she gave the affirmative, to which Zhang added: "My tongue is my capital, so long as I don't lose it, I will earn myself an official post."

Zhang was later appointed as the Prime Minister of Qin through a ruse of Su Qins (that's another story) and was instrumental in the division of the allied states aganist Qin, fronted by Su. With Zhang's help, Qin grew to be a super power amongst the warring states.
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Unread postby Pang Shiyuan » Fri May 02, 2003 12:43 pm

jiuwan wrote:This is how you pronounce it:

Cantonese - Ha Hou Dun

Mandarin - Sha Hou Dun

I know those aren't the correct pinyin (mandarin) but that's what it sounds like when you try to pronounce it. It's nothing like what Koei made it sound like. E.g. Kessen II - "Gee Ah Hou Dun" :lol: That pronouncation always cracks me up!


Pinyin: Xià Hóu Dun(1)

Pronunciation is something like Hsia(4) Hou(2) Doon(1), i think.

I love the way the Dynasty Warrior cutscenes have dubbed english pronunciations of officer names...

"Lord Cow Cow, Loo Bei is planning an attack with general Guan Yoo leading the vanguard..." :lol:
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Unread postby Shadowlink » Fri May 02, 2003 6:34 pm

Pang De army got flooded because of Guan Yu right? Also was Pang De very famous when he served ma chao because when i played koei games pang de has a lot of power.
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Unread postby Mengdez New Book » Sat May 03, 2003 2:18 am

Zhugeliang wrote:Pang De army got flooded because of Guan Yu right? Also was Pang De very famous when he served ma chao because when i played koei games pang de has a lot of power.

One of the reason that he was so famous because he never wanted to surrender to Guan Yu when he and Yu Jin were obviously defeated. Anyway, we have to compare him to Yu Jin, the veteren general to Cao Cao who surrendered to Guan Yu while Pang De, the newly join general who had been executed. Well, even Cao Cao was so amazed with Pang De. 8-)
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