Abortion

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Is it ok or not?

Yes
72
49%
No
55
37%
Other (please explain)
21
14%
 
Total votes : 148

Unread postby JCC » Mon Apr 16, 2007 7:25 pm

Ezekiel wrote:As much as I want it to be legal, I worry about some people throwing their inabitions to the wind, and just getting abortions as if they were check-ups. I wouldn't put it past some people in this world, and it's a shame.

It's an invasive, costly, and often emotionally draining procedure. I doubt anyone in their right mind would choose it "as a method of birth control", as some people seem to be worried about.
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Unread postby LKS » Mon Apr 16, 2007 8:40 pm

I agree with Ezikel on this point abortions in teh UK were origionally brought into legality in 1966 in response to the large number of back alley abortions that were both unhygenic and performed by unqualified surgeons.

The abortion was origionally brought into power in the Roe vs Wade supreme court case that was fought over a womens right to her body and as a result abortion was aruged to be acceptable as it was a womens right to remove things from her body. Now i think that people do use abortions as a quick way out and can often be like a check up .

As for ED he is right you cannot look on whether this is morally acceptable or unacceptable oyu cant look at individual cases but a overview of the whole thing , it does not make me foolish to look at it like that as some have said. The fact is that killing a baby whether it be beacuse you cant afford it , you were raped or more likely cause you are selfish and dont want a baby to bring down your happy go lucky lifestyle does not matter its still murder and thats the bottom line.

But of course im only giving the catholic side , which is of course if your a catholic is the truth , if your a atheist you can go with whatever you want , just a shame the papcy does not have as much control anymore.
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Unread postby Kong Wen » Mon Apr 16, 2007 8:55 pm

LKS wrote:...just a shame the papcy does not have as much control anymore.

Yeah, it's a damn shame we don't have one mighty authority figure to tell us all what to do. Then we wouldn't have the big problem we have with "freedom" nowadays. Especially for those pesky women. Why should they decide what happens to their bodies, when we could have a global dictator tell them what to do instead?
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Unread postby LKS » Mon Apr 16, 2007 9:02 pm

see now your seeing the light Kong , good to have you on board :wink:

Heck i can see why people get emotional with this but its a slippery slope you konw , if you have a right to your own body why not legalist Cocaine? LSD ? Hell why not legalise euthanasia , suicide , hell why not even self mutilation ? its all good? We have a right to do what we want to our bodies , as long as we dont hurt anyone , lets not worry about society as a whole no were the important ones , yep just us individuals.
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Unread postby Catalyst » Mon Apr 16, 2007 9:10 pm

LKS wrote:Heck i can see why people get emotional with this but its a slippery slope you konw , if you have a right to your own body why not legalist Cocaine? LSD ? Hell why not legalise euthanasia , suicide , hell why not even self mutilation ? its all good? We have a right to do what we want to our bodies , as long as we dont hurt anyone , lets not worry about society as a whole no were the important ones , yep just us individuals.


Should I feel bad that I think we SHOULD legalize all of that?

Sure, cocaine's bad, suicide's bad, but I really don't think we should have something that totally bans it. I've never seen anyone who's gotten arrested for using cocaine that's gotten out and not gone back to it. It doesn't happen. It's a useless set of laws.

Now, I'd be fine with setting up help clinics and stuff like that, something to help rehabilitate people instead of making it legally wrong for them to do something. Nothing good comes of a legal barrier for such decisions.
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Unread postby Kong Wen » Mon Apr 16, 2007 9:10 pm

LKS wrote:see now your seeing the light Kong , good to have you on board :wink:

Heck i can see why people get emotional with this but its a slippery slope you konw , if you have a right to your own body why not legalist Cocaine? LSD ? Hell why not legalise euthanasia , suicide , hell why not even self mutilation ? its all good? We have a right to do what we want to our bodies , as long as we dont hurt anyone , lets not worry about society as a whole no were the important ones , yep just us individuals.

Sounds good to me. :roll:

The difference between a legal abortion and your flippant remarks about drugs is that legal abortions are performed at health clinics by trained professionals for the health and safety of an individual. I don't see how your remarks are comparable. The only way your comparison could (maybe) make sense is if you're talking about legalizing cocaine (for example) in small doses at treatment centres to try to help wean people off of addictions, to help them gain control of addictions, and to protect them from "dirty" drugs and ruined lives. And that would actually be a good idea, and get a thumbs up from me.

(Hmm... I wonder how being concerned with freedom and civil liberties can be construed as "not worry[ing] about society as a whole...")
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Unread postby LKS » Mon Apr 16, 2007 9:18 pm

it raises the question Kong about freedom , i dont remember the quote or the person who said it but something along the lines that there is no freedom without laws.

Now the way i see it is that by saying that we have a right to do anything to our bodies that opens up justification for the use of drugs as they should be allowed as its our right to mess with the chemicals in our bodies as its our bodies. That was the point i was making , nothing to do with weaninig people off addictions just the point that its our bodies and lets mess with them.

Now for me abortion in cases like many of the ones mentioned is right but that does not compensate for the thousands upon thousands of abortions that are dont for the wrong reasons , for the good of society some must suffer , for the good of the people individuals must fall into line.
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Unread postby JCC » Mon Apr 16, 2007 9:20 pm

LKS wrote:Heck i can see why people get emotional with this but its a slippery slope you konw , if you have a right to your own body why not legalist Cocaine? LSD ? Hell why not legalise euthanasia , suicide , hell why not even self mutilation ? its all good? We have a right to do what we want to our bodies , as long as we dont hurt anyone , lets not worry about society as a whole no were the important ones , yep just us individuals.

Not sure what it has to do with worrying about society as a whole, but the rest of that sounds great. All those things should be legal! :)

However, as stated by others, they have little to do with the abortion argument, as abortion is about our right to protect our bodies, while drugs/suicide/self-mutilation is about our right to harm them. No need to bring up the latter in discussion of the former. But since you did, we, as the owners of our bodies, have the right to both.
Last edited by JCC on Mon Apr 16, 2007 9:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Unread postby Catalyst » Mon Apr 16, 2007 9:20 pm

LKS wrote:Now for me abortion in cases like many of the ones mentioned is right but that does not compensate for the thousands upon thousands of abortions that are dont for the wrong reasons , for the good of society some must suffer , for the good of the people individuals must fall into line.


So, you'd rather screw over everyone than just have a few of them "morally suffer"? That's pretty nice, bud.

The good people with honest intentions, under your rule, would be doomed to have children they can't afford. The others would have the same doom. But oh well, they're saved in heaven, if that truly exists.
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Unread postby LKS » Mon Apr 16, 2007 9:25 pm

i dont think anyone can have honest intentions and want an abortion , what i will say is that i can sympathyse with those who want an abortion for reasons that are understandable such as rape cases and cannot afford the child.

But yea why not? Society is a falling thing and is collapsing due to liberalist thinking , people are too free and it is become anarchtic , people need shepherding , controlling and discipline to bring the best out of them . This should be done under a wise and justified being such as the papacy or a good goverment .
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