Why sharks are imporant

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Why sharks are imporant

Unread postby Korin » Tue Apr 23, 2013 9:08 pm

I think sharks are imporant because we need them to survive + they are badass.

See Sharkwater for instance.
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Re: Why sharks are imporant

Unread postby James » Tue Apr 23, 2013 9:33 pm

Sharkwater?

We really do have a problem in our world with shark preservation. Particularly atrocious is the harvesting of sharks for their fins for shark fin soup, which can involve catching the shark, cutting off its fins, and throwing it back into the ocean, still alive, but soon to die. I don't think I could watch a friend ordering shark fin soup without saying something.
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Re: Why sharks are imporant

Unread postby Shikanosuke » Tue Apr 23, 2013 9:35 pm

James wrote:
I don't think I could watch a friend ordering shark fin soup without saying something.


Really? I agree with you about the shark preservation issue, but would it really bother you if someone ordered a meal involving sharks? Many vegetarians, vegans, as well as normal folks aren't happy with the conditions which many livestock and raised, kept, and slaughtered but I don't think they'd say anything. I'm just asking why this one makes it more special, I suppose.
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Re: Why sharks are imporant

Unread postby Korin » Tue Apr 23, 2013 9:42 pm

That sharkwater movie from 2006-2007, it was good knowledge and this tv show Whale Wars is like a tv verison of it but for whales.

I seriously hate poachers of any kind, the people who cook the shark fin soup are just ignorant scumbags that don't know where they got the fins from and from who. I mean if you use the shark as food, which I'm against 100% - use the whole shark, not just fins. FREAKING POACHERS.

I love Chinese history but these china shops that sell Fin soup are just dumb. I know other places in the world do it too but it's mostly China, IIRC?

Lifeshock is different, because they are made to eat--when sharks are unnatural to eat and some idiot decided to do it anyways, I mean they don't poach Lifeshock because that is different, sharks you are not supposed to eat because that's unnatural. I mean I think people been eating beef for thousands of years, but shark for how long? I also think it's nasty. And if we lose the sharks forever, we are dead in maybe less than 10,000 years or less, maybe only 2,000. Humans will become extinct because of lack of sharks eating other fish to keep the oceans level of small fish down. Sharks saving 4 life! Screw poachers.
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Re: Why sharks are imporant

Unread postby James » Tue Apr 23, 2013 9:43 pm

Shikanosuke wrote:Really? I agree with you about the shark preservation issue, but would it really bother you if someone ordered a meal involving sharks? Many vegetarians, vegans, as well as normal folks aren't happy with the conditions which many livestock and raised, kept, and slaughtered but I don't think they'd say anything. I'm just asking why this one makes it more special, I suppose.

There's an important distinction which needs to be emphasized. In the case of a hamburger someone is ordering a meal which, while it takes in part from the cow, it is taking in part from a cow which is wholly (to an unfortunate level, see 'recovered meat product') consumed for use. On a bizarre but similar level, the 'duck feet' that are available as a dim sum course are not the product of people catching ducks, chopping their feet off, and discarding them alive. If we were actually using the entire shark for meals and products I would not bridge the gap to saying something anymore than I would a person's choice to eat a hamburger—but unfortunately that is not the case at all. The shark fins are worth far more than the animal itself, and it is also frustrating to transport the animal, so many such 'fishermen' only concern themselves with the fins.
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Re: Why sharks are imporant

Unread postby James » Tue Apr 23, 2013 9:44 pm

Korin wrote:I seriously hate poachers of any kind, the people who cook the shark fin soup are just ignorant scumbags that don't know where they got the fins from and from who. I mean if you use the shark as food, which I'm against 100% - use the whole shark, not just fins. FREAKING POACHERS.

Korin, you don't know the people who make shark fin soup. Do not make summary judgements about them. Additionally, this bridges cultures and knowledge changes drastically, as does acceptable practice. You can find plenty of awful examples within American culture as well, or that of pretty much anywhere else. Please separate the anger from your responses.
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Re: Why sharks are imporant

Unread postby Korin » Tue Apr 23, 2013 10:09 pm

These are not fisherman, they are poachers. Duck feet is nasty too because you don't use whole duck, so WTF. - poachers for skins too is annoying cause they are too lazy to make money elsewhere. Whole sharks is different because you are using the whole, but I still don't believe in that because we can't do it so rapidly and have to wait long time so they can breed and make babies again, so we have more sharks but idiot people are not patience, so I hope there is society like me that believe we need sharks to survive, sharks are very special creatures and we need them to devour the oceans for us.

I heard a Han? person said they lose money because his shop got closed, I mean if you lose money, get another job!
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Re: Why sharks are imporant

Unread postby Sun Fin » Tue Apr 23, 2013 10:41 pm

James wrote: I don't think I could watch a friend ordering shark fin soup without saying something.


When I was in Barbados I had a buffet and one of the meats there was called Mau Mau, being relatively ignorant fellow when it comes to Bajon practises I put a bit on my plate. I got told after my first mouthful it was dolphin. Now I'm not normally squeamish at all when it comes to eating animals but that really bothered me.
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Re: Why sharks are imporant

Unread postby Lady Wu » Wed Apr 24, 2013 5:21 pm

On poaching
The thing is, while some Western places have banned shark fin (though a Canadian judge has overturned Toronto's shark fin ban on the grounds that the city has no power to control what people eat), shark fin-harvesting is not illegal in the countries where the sharks are caught. Therefore, harvesting shark fin isn't technically poaching.

On the morality of harvesting sharks
I think the real issue here is with the sustainability of shark fin-harvesting and the treatment of the caught sharks, rather than protecting sharks because they're special. If it's possible to catch sharks in a controlled way so that the stocks aren't depleted, then I don't see how catching sharks for food or otherwise is any worse than hunting moose or bears, both of which have a similar lifespan as sharks.

As for the treatment of the sharks in the shark fin trade, I agree that it's horrible--a waste, and an inhumane one at that. It's too bad most fishermen can't be bothered with utilizing the rest of the shark. Shark meat is totally edible!

I personally wouldn't order shark fin soup, but I wouldn't be bothered by it as long as it can be produced sustainably and ethically.

On people working in the shark fin trade
I would hesitate to put a blanket judgement on everyone who harvests, deals in, or cooks shark fin, because everyone's situation is different. Yes, there are people who know that it's wrong but still do it for the money. However, some people might live in places where it's not considered wrong to harvest shark fin. Or they really have no other way of making a living--it's easy for us in the West to say "get an education and get another job", but for many people around the world those aren't even accessible options. Perhaps their entire lives, and their parents' and their grandparents' lives, have been about harvesting shark fin? Perhaps their families need them to bring in the money now instead of later, for basic survival? You never know.

As for restaurants losing money and getting shut down because they couldn't serve shark fin, you really can't expect them to find a replacement specialty overnight. It takes time to phase out the demand and replace it with something more acceptable.

On duck feet
I don't know how duck feet came in, but people don't discard the rest of the duck when they prepare a duck feet dish. No more than discarding the rest of a chicken when making chicken feet. In fact, chicken feet and duck feet are parts of the birds that normally get thrown out ( = waste), but people got creative and managed to invent dishes that maximize the use of the birds. Think about all the parts of animals and birds that we don't routinely eat here in North America--heads, feet, internal organs--is that not a horrible waste as well?
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Re: Why sharks are imporant

Unread postby Human5 » Thu Apr 25, 2013 2:04 am

Korin wrote:poachers for skins too is annoying cause they are too lazy to make money elsewhere.

There's absolutely nothing lazy about catching sharks or hunting. Hunting for a living is definitely not an easy job. I'm also curious as to how you define poaching.

I hope there is society like me that believe we need sharks to survive, sharks are very special creatures and we need them to devour the oceans for us.

This makes no sense at all.
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