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When Is It Ok To Hire A Facist?

Unread postPosted: Wed Apr 03, 2013 10:54 am
by Dong Zhou
Or a Racist. Or a neo-Nazi. You get the picture.

Over here, there has been an uproar as top flight football/soccer club Sunderland has appointed Paolo Di Canio as manager. During his twilight spell as a player in home club Lazio, it came out that he was a fan of Mussolini, did Roman salutes, involved with the fascist Ultra's and is seen as a fascist himself. So his appointment has caused uproar in the media (though most of them didn't care when he was manager of Swindon) and among probably the majority of rival fans.

So was wondering, what jobs would it alarm you to see a fascist or such like take? When it is right or wrong for them to be given high profile jobs? Or normal jobs.

Re: When Is It Ok To Hire A Facist?

Unread postPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 1:27 am
by Shikanosuke
You know, thats a tough one for me. However, I'd have to say its always ok to hire a fascist. Just because you're a fascist doesn't mean you don't have to comply with certain employment guidelines. I'm sure there are plenty or fascists/racists (probably all us to some extent) in any number of jobs. But so long as their ideologies and actions don't conflict with the execution of certain job functions (including customer and inter-office relations) I don't see why it should be grounds for non-hire or dismissal.

EDIT: All that aside though, business is a lot about perception so I could understand not hiring certain outspoken individuals (even if its past actions and not current ones) if it would negatively reflect on the institution and cause financial harm.

Re: When Is It Ok To Hire A Facist?

Unread postPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 9:03 am
by Zhai Rong
When is it okay to not hire someone on account of his fascism? I would say that it depends on whether he acts upon it or just likes to talk about it. If the former, he might be a bad idea for jobs such as human rights lawyer and multicultural festival organiser.

Talk alone is mostly harmless, but may turn away customers and employees. Will Di Canio's fascist views turn away players who would otherwise have been keen on signing for a club struggling against relegation? Will it disgust fans, making them stop going to Sunderland games and instead become rabid Gateshead supporters? I don't doubt that there'll be a bit of both, but Sunderland must have assessed that it's a worthwhile price to pay for a manager with enough skill to keep them in the top flight.

Re: When Is It Ok To Hire A Facist?

Unread postPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 4:32 pm
by Aygor
I'd just point out that he won the Fair Play award in '99/'00 playing for West Ham.
He is a honest and decent person, I am sure he is not racist and I can't see how (or why) his political views should have anything to do with his job.
If he were communist nobody would have a problem with it, I personally find this disparity of opinion despicable.

I don't want to start a discussion about this, but I want to stress how Fascism and Nazism are two very different ideologies and political systems with very different stories which should never be mixed as unfortunately happens most of the times.

Since racism seems to be the main issue I would also point out that in the 21 years of fascist governament, antisemitism (not widespread racism) was an issue only in the last 4 years, inroduced through Gobbels' propaganda when Italy was, as much as it pains me to say, little more than a province of Germany.
Funnily enough the most famous song from the fascist time is about the love of italian men for abissinian (Ethiopia, italian colony at the time, was called Abissinia) women.

Re: When Is It Ok To Hire A Facist?

Unread postPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2013 2:30 pm
by Dong Zhou
Aygor wrote:I'd just point out that he won the Fair Play award in '99/'00 playing for West Ham.


Indeed.

Aygor wrote:If he were communist nobody would have a problem with it, I personally find this disparity of opinion despicable.


Communism is sometimes seen as idealistic but if a communist manager came in, bar questions about squaring his belief's with multimillionaire football, yes he would probably be fine. He wouldn't be if he wrote or talked about Stalin in a positive manner.

The salute though has very negative connotations in this country and facisim is considered something that this country fought against, a reminder of the 1930's and 40's. Certainly considered by some in Sunderland as against everything the town and it's own history stands for.

Re: When Is It Ok To Hire A Facist?

Unread postPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2013 4:19 pm
by Sun Fin
Personally unless Di Canio has done something illegal I don't think that there are grounds to dismiss him for his political views unless they contradict the founding principles of the said organisation. So in this case as much as I dislike the man I don't think he should be sacked.

However I can also understand why a (ex) Labour MP would wish to avoid association with him and I understand why he felt he needed to resign.

Re: When Is It Ok To Hire A Facist?

Unread postPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 10:03 am
by Aygor
Dong Zhou wrote:The salute though has very negative connotations in this country and facisim is considered something that this country fought against, a reminder of the 1930's and 40's.

I understand the feeling, in Italy, as we had a civil war against fascism, the roman salute is illegal.
I can also understand an ex labour party feeling it's best not being associated with him as Sun Fin pointed out.
I can't understand, and it actually bothers me very much, doubting one's professionality, morality, capability due to political reasons.
Sun Fin wrote:as much as I dislike the man

A couple of years ago I had the opportunity to see him on television discussing several topics, some football related some not.
I was very surprised, as at the time I considered him a honest but somewhat imbecille individual, to find out he actually is polite, moderate, well informed and a proficient talker.

Re: When Is It Ok To Hire A Facist?

Unread postPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 10:15 am
by Dong Zhou
I wouldn't have hired Di Canio as I felt he needed time in the Championship to hone his craft and till he stops alarming the police with his actions. His beliefs? As long as belief's don't hinder doing the job well and fairly to all then an employer should be able to hire him or her.

Aygor wrote:I can't understand, and it actually bothers me very much, doubting one's professionality, morality, capability due to political reasons.


It happens. I know people who, if they knew someone ever thought of voting Tory, would consider them on the lines of Satan. We all do it though, if we know someone is a BNP or a neo-Nazi, we do judge them morally.

Re: When Is It Ok To Hire A Facist?

Unread postPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 1:26 pm
by Sun Fin
Dong Zhou wrote:
It happens. I know people who, if they knew someone ever thought of voting Tory, would consider them on the lines of Satan. We all do it though, if we know someone is a BNP or a neo-Nazi, we do judge them morally.


I've experienced that kind of reaction because I freely admit I've voted Conservative, although I get that reaction more often if I say that I'm an evangelical Christian. As Aygor says this is the problem, the fact that it is so prevalent in society makes it more of an issue not less. Just because society says it’s acceptable to treat someone like that because they have different political beliefs to you doesn’t make it so.

Re: When Is It Ok To Hire A Facist?

Unread postPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 8:20 pm
by Human5
Dong Zhou wrote:Or a Racist.

If it's never ok, then very few, if any people would have a job.

It's okay, if the person does not affect the company. You can be racist and have a job, but that does not mean that you would openly discriminate against someone.

It is from my observation that many people are racist but they never openly show it, because they know it is wrong. But you can't just tell yourself to not be racist. That's not how a person's mind works.

So was wondering, what jobs would it alarm you to see a fascist or such like take?

Government jobs.