Thomas More wrote:So that it is plain they must prefer iron either to gold or silver; for men can no more live without iron than without fire or water, but nature has marked out no use for the other metals, so essential as not easily to be dispensed with. The folly of men has enhanced the value of gold and silver, because of their scarcity. Whereas, on the contrary, it is their opinion that nature, as an indulgent parent, has freely given us all the best things in great abundance, such as water and earth, but has laid up and hid from us the things that are vain and useless.
Ratzalot wrote:It can be, but not at the moment. It might be a bubble when the central banks stop printing/digitally creating obscene amounts of fiat.
Ratzalot wrote:It can be, but not at the moment. It might be a bubble when the central banks stop printing/digitally creating obscene amounts of fiat. The global economic crisis is only in its adolescent stages, so gold and silver have an excellent path ahead of them. The recent down-turn in gold and silver can be attributed to liquidity issues.
Ratzalot wrote:Although the value of gold and silver are a perception of worth (as WWD has alluded), man has deemed them money for thousands of years. Under Thomas More's thinking, things such as water, land, and iron should be valued highest. Obviously that isn't the world we live in, except for maybe land.
Ratzalot wrote:You also can't create more gold or silver as they are star metals.
James wrote:I would be inclined to disagree. Gold has increased in price disproportionately to historic trends and other precious metals or commodities. It seems to be associated as much with propaganda and marketing campaigns as for any other practical reason. Some considerable increase is to be expected as we are in a recession, but what we see today can hardly be described as practical, or expected to any extent. Add to that the fact that the bottom can (and has) fallen out of gold, and I think it is safe to describe it as a bubble in ways.
James wrote:Add to that the fact that the bottom can (and has) fallen out of gold, and I think it is safe to describe it as a bubble in ways.
Ratzalot wrote:There was a rather direct correlation between the price of gold and QE1/QE2.
Ratzalot wrote:When did the bottom fall out of gold?
Ratzalot wrote:I wasn't aware of this. Regardless, we'll have to wait and see. I follow the major technical trend lines for gold as well as the fundamentals. Depending on the chart you want to consider, there are trend lines calling for further declines in gold prices, stabilization in prices, and increases in prices for the near future.
bodidley wrote:Actually right now the banks aren't printing huge amounts of money because A. We are paying for government expenses with debt, rather than by printing new money B. the debt exitst in the form of treasury securities, so the amount of currency put into circulation is a zero-sum game. C. The cash money doesn't actually exist, money only exists because we agree it exists. If you've got $30k in the bank that cash doesn't exist anywhere. The Fed. only prints enough money for general use in circulation. When the money becomes unusable it's destroyed. Look in your wallet and see how many dollar bills you have from the 1970s. Probably none, right? Inflation isn't as bad right now as it was in the 70s 80s and 90s.
bodidley wrote:It isn't the world we live in where gold is a currency! It isn't even traded on the currency market it's a commodity and has to be sold as such in exchange for currency. We can't go back to the gold standard because the net wealth of the U.S. is about 58 trillion and the U.S. only has 595.68 billion in gold at current prices. If you want the currency to devalue by 99% overnight gold standard is a good idea.
bodidley wrote:Not true. People are mining more gold all the time and adding gold to the market. Gold prices weren't even stable when it was used as currency. In 1492 gold to silver prices were about 1 to 16, after the Spanish conquest of the New World and the wars of religion new gold going on the market devalued gold to 1 to 4 in relation to silver. It's one reason the Spanish Empire went bankrupt and lost power in Europe.
James wrote:A connection which explains its pricing in full? In addition to the other issues I suggested? I'm not biting on that one. Care to elaborate?
Ratzalot wrote:I prefer to believe gold and silver are the closest thing to "real" money as evidenced by thousands of years of such practice.
Ratzalot wrote: Unless we come up with a good technology to extract molten gold and silver from the Earth's core, I believe gold and silver will continue to rise steadily and eventually skyrocket beyond anything we can imagine.
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