UK Politics

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Re: UK Politics

Unread postby Dong Zhou » Sat Sep 14, 2019 6:10 pm

Lib Dem conference preview
Lib Dem conference at Bournemouth

-Good Or Bad Year: Good few months, there was a worry their Brexit stance hadn't worked, past still haunted them a tad and Sir Cable wasn't cutting through so announced he would step down but the summer has gone really well for them, winners in local elections, best Remain party in Europe, winning by-elections, a series of defections including three in a week with the likes of Berger and Umunna really added some weight, a rising star as leader. The chaos of parliament has seen a bigger role then they would normally have and more attention for Lib Dems, which they must now seize on, though that does mean Swinson is under more scrutiny and her "no to Corbyn as leader" saw her take a knock in Westminster. They will enter in good mood

They need:

-Nothing major to happen that overshadows conference, this is their moment in the sun

-Brexit and? We know their stance on Brexit but what do they offer Lib Dem Brexiteers (which has worried likes of Sir Lamb) and Brexiteers? What does being the centre ground actually mean? At some point Brexit wont be the big issue and an election tends to spirral away from the one issue, the Lib Dems need to show they are more then just a Remain party of liberal leanings. Bar Remain (or despite Remain), why should voter A B and C vote for team orange? What is the overall vision?

-Though people have moved on bar a few who are never likely to vote for Lib Dems anyway, still can seem like the party needs to be a little more comfortable owning the Coalition years. They are getting better at it, they are more comfortable in last year or two then in past about it

-Swinson's hello on Tuesday. People may have seen one or two clips of her thanks to Brexit, in political circles she is well regarded, but first conference speech is her chance to reach out to the wider public who barely know her. Set out her background, give a sense of the person and the vision, impress them. It will be a big blow to Lib Dems if she can't make a good impression with this speech

-Lib Dems will usually claim they are aiming to win but realistically, if they won't work with Boris or Corbyn if potential king-makers, how exactly do they plan to influence events long term and get their plans into law? It is all very well posturing or the purity of small parties but don't the Lib Dems aim for more? Even if either requires major holding of nose to deal any sort of deal with

-How much to attack Corbyn? They need to distance themselves from him but they also need to work with him at least for a time so pull punches or go for it and hope "yeah that is party conference time" shrug off

-Keep the optimism and sense of momentum going. Lib Dems may hope for a surprise addition or something after recent events just to keep things going (while Umunna has the highly prized "second" slot on Monday) but even without one, they need to leave with hopes in their hearts rather then a damp squib that kills momentum and without errors.

-Their famous Lib Dem songs to remain fun


======

Cameron speaks out, Brexit, Speaker
-Papers on Cameron speaking out

-Cameron doesn't regret referendum but apologises for what followed and he will never be forgiven while the result has left him depressed, he failed during the referendum to get through the Tory psychodrama, "£350" million was Boris and Gove leaving truth at home and they behaved appallingly while those two plus Morduant and Patel attacked their own government in ways he didn't think possible. Was shocked at strength of anti-EU feeling in party (how the?), Boris never wanted Brexit, might need to be a second referendum due to how stuck country is. This is painful to watch, opposes no deal, the proroguing and the purge, losing Gove as a friend has been very difficult, praises May for her work-ethic and ethos of public service, was maddening watching Brexiteers vote down Brexit

-£95 million to be used to try to revive high-streets

-Boris says nobody will deter him from leaving on Oct31st but cautiously optimistic of getting deal, Bercow warns if executive tries to doge around law then he may allow some inventive parliamentary efforts to stop it, DUP not happy with Times journalism over dismissed claims they are weakening on backstop. Sammy Wilson says if Boris tries a N.Ireland backstop then Tory ranks won't back him

-McDonnell says Bercow is acting properly

-Tories accused of changing BBC headline in their adverts

-Shailesh Vara and Sir Henry Bellingham (historians would love that one) running for Speaker

=====

-Lord Lilley not happy Cameron used phrase Tory psychodrama about Brexit and calls it a Westminster bubble ignorance

-Fabricant accuses Bercow of bringing office into disrepute

====

-Jayne McCormack on chances of DUP compromise

-O'Grady does a disgusting "I don't know if he did this..." to start but argues Cameron is scapegoated for referendum

-Harry Phibbs wants a traditional speaker

-Freedland parliament needs to be recalled to uphold our democracy

-Peter Barnes a glance at the polls
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Re: UK Politics

Unread postby Dong Zhou » Sun Sep 15, 2019 5:32 pm

Lib Dem defection 4, Brexit, Cameron continues attack
-Papers on Boris, Cameron or defection

-Former Universities Minister Sam Gyimah joins Lib Dems, says Tories have moved away from the One Nation Tories that attracted him as an immigrant to an intolerant party that undermines court and attacks experts for disagreeing, can disagree on Brexit but is worried by the slide towards populism and English nationalism, couldn't agree to scorched earth Brexit demands for entry to Tory party. Lib Dems provide the centre ground missing from two main parties and a chance to reshape it with Lib Dems, should not be complacent that institutions will survive populism.

Blow to Tories as he had been rising through their ranks, an intelligent figure who handled media well and was respected across the house, part of the Tory moderate One Nation wing. Great timing for Lib Dems, their conference added to with momentum and a splash (hough one one front page headline) to open, another Tory rather then just another left-winger, someone who they may feel can add to... not star power but clout in Westminster and they can have showing a party reaching out to all though one wonders how Gyimah's economic policies will mesh with Lib Dems

-Jo Swinson condemns Boris and Labour over Brexit, wants party to agree to revoke article 50 to make them clearly Remain (I feel this is going to alienate a fair few potential voters and hurt them badly in election debates ad interviews, they will struggle to get any hearing on anything else)

-Boris says we will break free of EU manacles like the Incredible Hulk

-Cameron calls Gove "an ambassador for truth-twisting age of populism", also a "a foam-flecked Faragist" and says Boris has proposed privately a second referendum while goes further in his claims Boris chose Brexit to be darling of the Tory party so he could become leader rather then believes in Brexit, was unable to fire Patel as would have made her a Brexit martyr despite her attacks. Gove tended to range way off his brief in cabinet which was not always welcome, wife persuaded him to push for gay marriage

-Jenrick clamping down on anti-Semitism in public life

-Sturgeon hit in head by swingball

====

-Mayor Khan says Boris and Patel gets knife crime and impact of austerity

-Sir Cable says any deal should go to referendum

====

-Rawnsley Swinson is a wild card
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Re: UK Politics

Unread postby Sun Fin » Mon Sep 16, 2019 6:22 pm

Dong Zhou wrote:
-Former Universities Minister Sam Gyimah joins Lib Dems, says Tories have moved away from the One Nation Tories that attracted him as an immigrant to an intolerant party that undermines court and attacks experts for disagreeing, can disagree on Brexit but is worried by the slide towards populism and English nationalism, couldn't agree to scorched earth Brexit demands for entry to Tory party. Lib Dems provide the centre ground missing from two main parties and a chance to reshape it with Lib Dems, should not be complacent that institutions will survive populism.


This is an interesting point. I'd love to know what the Lib Dem's screening procedure is for accepting labour/Tory MPs. It might generate good headlines now but they might regret letting anyone in who is just anti-Brexit as it could cause them issues when they try and move past this one issue...
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Re: UK Politics

Unread postby Dong Zhou » Mon Sep 16, 2019 7:27 pm

Sun Fin wrote:
This is an interesting point. I'd love to know what the Lib Dem's screening procedure is for accepting labour/Tory MPs. It might generate good headlines now but they might regret letting anyone in who is just anti-Brexit as it could cause them issues when they try and move past this one issue...


Lib Dems say something vague about meeting chief whip, ensuring values align. Truly I doubt it is much done bar checking not an absolute disaster

I think 1) there is some bias about the concerns (not you, those within Lib Dems). Somehow only the Tories seem to get the major objections as if Labour MP's won't have the same issues. They don't seem to be demanding Lib Dems stop targeting Tory seats, they want the Tories votes but not anything more, purity above all

2) Beneath the... bias behind the issue, one does have concerns that seizing the chances for the short news of defections and numbers may lead to some uneasy long term allies. At the moment Lib Dem left is more on top then the right but won't always be so the right can wait but what tensions will there be on economic policy and the like? More then the usual party splits? I suspect one or two may discreetly retire sooner rather then later

Lib Dems, Brexit, horrific guardian attack on Cameron, Boris humiliated by a world power
-Papers on Boris confidence

-Despite the effort of the likes of Simon Hughes, Lib Dems now will revoke article 50 if win election which I feel is a big mistake. How does this win over soft Remainers, soft Brexiteers who may disagree but back Lib Dems for other things? "Referendum and fight for Remain" is one thing, that is a democratic referendum with hopes of stopping a Brexit but people may feel rather squeamish about overturning a referendum decision without consulting the people. The media and opponents will bring this up again and again during campaign so ensuring no other message can get out.

-Fury as Guardian editorial with no named writer says Cameron only experience privileged pain in the death of his son Ivan. Javid says he has never seen as editorial lacking such empathy, Cleverly wonders how any editor thought this was fine to publish. After initial amendments didn't work, they removed it and now have brought it back with offensive sections removed and noting "This editorial was amended on 15 September 2019. The original version of this editorial posted online fell far short of our standards. It has now been amended, and we apologise completely." slightly stronger then boiler plate apology but not much

Nobody has been named, no disciplinary action promised, no donation to charity, no promise to look at such a culture that would allow this in their editorial. Guardian showing Westminster that political class have, in some ways, higher standards and transparency then the newspapers who attack the political class. Be interesting to see if media hold guardian to account on this in way they would politicians and business over this

-Swinson heckled over Dr Lee joining, says she hasn't forgiven Cameron over referendum which she called a shocking misjudgement (plenty pointing out Lib Dems wanted a referendum), open to electoral pacts and in such talks but won't have any with Labour

-Verhofstadt says Hulk comparisons were infantile, Boris says pret lunch deal within our grasp and despite the law UK won't extend beyond October, Barnier+Barclay and David Frost to be at Boris/Juncker meeting. Barclay says landing zone for deal within sight, Patel says machinery of government focused on getting deal. Juncker says no patriotic Britain could want no deal due to mess it would leave country in and Europe never loses patience while he picks up lunch tab, Finnish European affairs minister Tytti Tuppurainen says open to UK but we still haven't provided a practical backstop replacement.

Phil Hogan warns it could take eight months to form a new trade negotiating team, Belgian foreign minister Didier Reynders says Boris needs to bring ideas. Downing Street confirm won't seek to extend transition but the report UK backstop plans rely on say we need 2-3 years rather then 14 months of transition, Alexander Schallenberg the Austrian foreign affairs minister had warned failure to bring forward plans today would lead to no deal. Benn points out Boris promised within 30 days to MP's to bring forward alternative backstop plans so has 4 days left

-Paschal Donohoe Ireland’s finance minister says UK plans to diverge have a real impact on Ireland and has implications on Good Friday agreement that needs sorting. Nnionists have nothing to fear from backstop with Ireland having taken such concerns seriously but argues backstop is a compromise to provide certainty to business and Irish society,

-Government to toughen sentences for certain crimes

-Felt Patel was really reluctant to go over past be it referendum, her comments or anything else on Marr show

-Boris says Tories are a great and old pact that do not form electoral pacts, doesn't rule out allowing the purged back but says the reason he had to be so strict as "They were effectively handing the initiative to our opponents," (something Boris did all the time), if movement happens in next few days then can have deal ready by EU summit

-Lord Trimble backstop breaches Belfast agreement

-Raab condemns attack on Saudi oil refinery as despicable and against international law but not clear who is behind it and need full facts first before action. On Brexit claims EU know the UK plans but just haven't been formally laid out as risks being a trap, time for EU to compromise, will not extend transition period that currently set to end Dec 2020, will behave lawfully but really going to test the deeply flawed Benn act

-After the lunch, Juncker says no backstop plans unveiled but both sides agree to step up of the talks, Boris says just enough time to get deal done by summit and speaks to press in private, lot of work been done on backstop, confident as can see shape of the deal, points would have been drowned out and not fair to Bettel to have that due to protestors, negotiation are not a sham. Boris "the Incredible Hulk" cancels press conference in Luxembourg due to protests against him (will be fury with Boris team for allowing an easy to be booed out placing for press conference as protesters where apparently only 30 yards away from podiums), number 10 claiming they asked it to be moved inside and were rejected, Luxembourg say there wasn't room for all press and would have been unfair to select only a few. The Incredible Sulk jokes going around while Xavier Bettel empty podiums Boris and is repeatedly applauded.

Battel Welcomes demonstrates as part of democracy, remarks Luxembourg has never seen a PM say they will break the law. UK always been close friend and always will be, country can't be held hostage for political reasons and clock is ticking for UK so Boris has to use time wisely, heard no new proposals or seen any progress from last year, extension won't be granted for sake of it. UK can't blame EU because UK is in a mess due to UK's own actions, he can't guarantee Boris will get deal through parliament, EU should have confronted Brexiteers about the lies during the campaign, speaking about delays is not in the interests of EU citizens in London who are living through a nightmare of uncertainty and their futures being hold hostage for party political gain. Thinks if no deal would take years to agree trade terms

This will provide great fun in Westminster, brave brave sir Boris running away again, humiliated by the one smallest countries in Europe showing his incompetence and lack of respect, will damage him abroad for that cowardly incompetence. Among UK public? This will either be extremely embarrassing for Boris and weaken his standing as he gets blamed for humiliating the nation before the world or outrage among the UK public against evil arrogant EU for humiliating brave Britannia and this further justifies the need to escape

-Scottish Tories suspend leadership race till next year to... well situation UK is in

-UK skips EU's general affairs council meeting today

=====

-Gauke rebels were right and three Brexit paths we can go down

-Sir Lamb says universities need to do a lot more on student mental health with some not even monitoring or keeping track, wants legally bound charter setting out minimum standards

-Jane Dodd, Welsh Lib Dem leader, says Boris and Corbyn are poisonousness in way they manage their parties, wants Wales in union but with a more meaningful parliament, rules out returning to politics

-Sir Davey surprisingly testy with Coburn and the panellists on polticslive

-Cameron says cuts were difficult and perhaps he should have gone quicker to get pain over sooner, admits he didn't get all the cuts right, Boris texted him he expected Brexit to be crushed, proroguing counter-productive as requires parliament but likely sharp practise rather then illegal, purge risks being a disaster.

-Telegraph's Michael Deacon "My favourite episode of The Incredible Hulk is the one where a small group of people shouted too loudly so he ran away"

-Hannan "The Luxembourg PM chose to go ahead with what was, in effect, an anti-Brexit rally rather than a press conference. Petty but calculated gestures of this kind from Euro-federalists pushed Britain into wanting to leave in the first place."

====

-Peston political crises more alarming then the finical crises

-Paul Waugh profiles Cummings

-Henry Hill defends idea of Royal Veto being used

-Professor Abhinay Muthoo says Cummings may be using game theory but is doing it badly

-Peter Fosters runs the rule on which potential deal has best chance of passing EU and UK
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Re: UK Politics

Unread postby Dong Zhou » Tue Sep 17, 2019 6:30 pm

Swinson speech, Boris, Brexit
Swinson speech: A good delivery, had an optimistic tone, put emotion at the right place, stunning seguing from Ashdown funeral to ambition via use of Westminster Abbey but not when talking about innovation then going onto wellness budget which she admits has been done by likes of New Zealand. Ending phase was a bit little too long though well delivered, nice touch getting new members to stand up, managed to go for aiming for PM without sounding arrogant or deluded, pitches her camp very much in the liberal, optimistic centre, as a vision for change.

Didn't really build personal story though one or two touches, focused attacks on Boris wit a mixture of wit and firmness, some good lines like Boris can't even negotiate a press conference, he hates socialists yet acts like a socialist dictator, that Brexit leaders won't be there when a person loses their job, loses their marriage due to strain. Surprisingly little on Corbyn and less effective when going there, didn't build the case he is really a Brexiteer as if just assumed.

Beyond Brexit, she spoke powerfully of the union and made a pitch to Scotland to back Lib Dems to help them keep the union and Remain, to send a message to rest of UK. She talked of a well being budget and GDP not enough, went big on climate change/green issues (climate risk reporting, Green Investment Bank) which is a wise move as they fight Greens and like Gove see this as a major issue no party yet owns but could be electorally key, sees knife crime as a public health issue and youth centres key, talked of mental health briefly.

A game changer? No. It was good rather then great, seems more at pleasing the base with reaching out to Remainers, Scotland and Green inclined figures but the focus on Supreme Court means this is being overshadowed, will give them a fillip though but they need more policies outside of climate change.

=======

-Papers mostly on Boris humiliation but Express is fuming at the cheek and says it shows we are right to leave while other Brexiteer papers feel Luxembourg broke protocols and tricked Boris

-Boris says he won't reveal publicly his EU plans, backstop allows EU to control trade, laws and tariffs and refuses 3 times to explain his answer to the problem rather then why he hates the backstop but is doable with energy and goodwill. Commission "not seen any solution" is just negotiating stance and they clearly believe UK can come up with answers and they really want a deal, will obey the law and refuse to ask for extension, costs £250 million a week to stay in (is that bigger or larger then 350 million?)

-Blackford says Boris needs to stop dealing in fiction and bluff and show the truth, unveil his plans. Benn writes to Gove asking him to explain why Yellowhammer documents had different situation titles, Europe's Commission ask for backstop proposals.

-Raab speaking with a fair few counterparts about attack on Saudi oil

-Labour calls for Truss to resign after she admits her department breached court orders and sold weapons to Saudi Arabia, Truss apologises but Labour will press this.

-Government pushes back smart meter deadline to 2024

-Rees-Mogg with a good humoured response to (now sacked) Lib Dem candidate saying senior Tories should be burnt at the stake "Typical Lib Dem. Mr Milne should get his facts straight. As Lord President of the Council, I am entitled to the privilege of being beheaded"

-Buckland refuses to rule out Boris breaking law as end of October feels a long way away

-Julian Smith says it would be really helpful if Stormont could be revived and they could have a role in Brexit

====

-Sir Soames feels PM Bettel grandstanding was unhelpful, Francois says this was a deliberate set up, Ruth Davidson says she dosesn't know if Boris believes in Brexit as can't see into his heart.

-Cameron admits he misread Commons on Syria, found Boris and Gove behaviour during referendum depressing and didn't feel it was their real selves

-Verhofstadt went to Lib Dem conference, Umunna bemoans Corbyn's support of authoritarian regimes and allowing supporters to vilify and abuse others, Lamb warns party playing with fire with new Brexit policy and risk breaking social contract.

-Sir Leigh promises to treat MP's as adult as Speaker, modelling himself on Lord Fowler, and would abolish September sittings

====

-Tom Peck Cameron truly is heir to Blair

-Toynbee Lib Dem mistakes has given Labour big opportunity

-Stephen Booth EU frustration showing

-Zoe Williams climate change isn't reason for Labour leadership to try to inch away from Remain

-Robert Peston an awkward question for MP's who oppose Boris comes up in court
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Re: UK Politics

Unread postby Sun Fin » Tue Sep 17, 2019 9:29 pm

Dong Zhou wrote:Lib Dems say something vague about meeting chief whip, ensuring values align. Truly I doubt it is much done bar checking not an absolute disaster

I think 1) there is some bias about the concerns (not you, those within Lib Dems). Somehow only the Tories seem to get the major objections as if Labour MP's won't have the same issues. They don't seem to be demanding Lib Dems stop targeting Tory seats, they want the Tories votes but not anything more, purity above all

2) Beneath the... bias behind the issue, one does have concerns that seizing the chances for the short news of defections and numbers may lead to some uneasy long term allies. At the moment Lib Dem left is more on top then the right but won't always be so the right can wait but what tensions will there be on economic policy and the like? More then the usual party splits? I suspect one or two may discreetly retire sooner rather then later


I’m not very knowledgeable when it comes to Lib Dem’s internal politics but I thought that it was the right wing (or free market wing) of their party that was in the ascendency at the moment? I think I presumed that the whole party was pretty left and united on social issues and divisions came on economic issues. Speaking of which, I presume of what I know of him Sam Gyimah will be a good fit. My question was more in relation to Lee, who seems to be a more awkward fit with regards to the party’s wider policies.

Dong Zhou wrote:-Despite the effort of the likes of Simon Hughes, Lib Dems now will revoke article 50 if win election which I feel is a big mistake. How does this win over soft Remainers, soft Brexiteers who may disagree but back Lib Dems for other things? "Referendum and fight for Remain" is one thing, that is a democratic referendum with hopes of stopping a Brexit but people may feel rather squeamish about overturning a referendum decision without consulting the people. The media and opponents will bring this up again and again during campaign so ensuring no other message can get out.


An article you shared today made a fantastic point: the party who wants governmental reform, as they believe that first past the post politics isn’t truly representative as governments can win with just 30% of the vote, are now arguing that winning an election by those rules is more valid than a referendum that won a genuine majority. Screams of hypocrites might begin to follow them…

Dong Zhou wrote:-Fury as Guardian editorial with no named writer says Cameron only experience privileged pain in the death of his son Ivan. Javid says he has never seen as editorial lacking such empathy, Cleverly wonders how any editor thought this was fine to publish. After initial amendments didn't work, they removed it and now have brought it back with offensive sections removed and noting "This editorial was amended on 15 September 2019. The original version of this editorial posted online fell far short of our standards. It has now been amended, and we apologise completely." slightly stronger then boiler plate apology but not much

Nobody has been named, no disciplinary action promised, no donation to charity, no promise to look at such a culture that would allow this in their editorial. Guardian showing Westminster that political class have, in some ways, higher standards and transparency then the newspapers who attack the political class. Be interesting to see if media hold guardian to account on this in way they would politicians and business over this


This story is horrific, along with the Sun’s story on Stokes shows that our media have learnt nothing and are an absolute disgrace. I can’t stand our news reporting culture.

Also, you've got a new avatar! But we should probably discuss it here...
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Re: UK Politics

Unread postby Dong Zhou » Wed Sep 18, 2019 6:48 pm

I’m not very knowledgeable when it comes to Lib Dem’s internal politics but I thought that it was the right wing (or free market wing) of their party that was in the ascendency at the moment? I think I presumed that the whole party was pretty left and united on social issues and divisions came on economic issues. Speaking of which, I presume of what I know of him Sam Gyimah will be a good fit. My question was more in relation to Lee, who seems to be a more awkward fit with regards to the party’s wider policies.


I think the orange bookers lost control after the coalition but I could be wrong. Yes they tend to be united behind social issues with divisions sometimes about the pace of change

I also have doubts about Dr Lee

An article you shared today made a fantastic point: the party who wants governmental reform, as they believe that first past the post politics isn’t truly representative as governments can win with just 30% of the vote, are now arguing that winning an election by those rules is more valid than a referendum that won a genuine majority. Screams of hypocrites might begin to follow them…


Yes I'm starting to see the democrats issue via various routes being raised

Brexit, Supreme Court, Poland
-Papers on Brexit, diabetes and Supreme Court hearing, Finical Times thinks Carney may be asked to stay on a little longer till after an election

-Conveney says backstop plans not yet been presented, is reasonable for EU to say removing backstop creates huge problems and since you want backstop gone how will you solve the problems, won't sign up to deal that requires checks bar as an emergency temporary measure

-Woody Johnson says Luxembourg's treatment of Boris shows why UK want out of EU, Baroness Chakrabarti says Lib Dem revoke policy is illiberal and anti-democratic, Corbyn on Labour's Brexit stance with a sense Corbyn is hintng he will be neutral during any referendum, Drakeford says Labour must be a Remain party.

In MEP debate, Juncker says talks were constructive and positive attitude but risk of no deal is palpable as very little time to close a deal and isn't sure they will do so, open to backstop alternatives but UK yet to present one, jokes after Brexit party applause for no deal that they are his groupies. Finnish European affairs minister Tytti Tuppurainen on behalf of Commission warns MEP's EU is facing more rather then less uncertainty due to Boris, Farage says deal is very close but deal will be a very bad one, "pipsqueak" Bittel shows EU can't be trusted to act in good faith

-Barnier says to MEP's risk to Ireland is a big problem in talks and UK says what it doesn't like about backstop but still not come up with alternatives, hints BSE is a reminder of why there needs to be checks on cattle but willing to work day and night for deal, warns UK wants to reopen May's commitments to maintaining level playing field, three years on we shouldn't be pretending to negotiate but moving forward. Questions currently being asked won't fade away in talks if no deal, the consequences of no deal to both sides are considerable

-Labour break away from it's students body LabourStudents with Momentum wanting a new body set up

-Truss says freedom of movement is part of trade talks with Australia

-Lib Dems would set up a set up a citizens' assembly on how UK would hit net-zero carbon emissions by 2045 or earlier if possible

-Boris heckled at hospital walkabout

-Leadsom orders investigation into Cobham takeover on national security grounds

-Concerns as Labour candidate Emily Owen says she was raped last year for political reasons

-Political parties and N.Ireland's journalist union condemn Ian Paisley for his Facebook attack against News Letter political editor Sam McBride

-Inflation lowest since 2016 at 1.7% thanks to clothing and recreation prices dropping, quite a drop from 2.1%

-Poland's ambassador Arkady Rzegocki has urged Poles here to consider returning as is concerned about application process here

-As I understand the Supreme Court, the rebels led by the surgical Lord Pannick and then by a entertaining and not perhaps entirely tactful Aidan O'Neill has gone for Boris character (while having to fend off "why didn't MP's vote him out if they were worried that much"), the lies, the motive to argue these are extraordinary events that require judicial intervention to keep parliament standing and overseeing the executive. They have done well on the motives and the character but if the judges have the right to intervene remains the tricky part.

The government led by Advocate General of Scotland Lord Keen and then by Sir James Eddie (who did well by all accounts) have pretty much left the field for their opponents about character, honesty, motive, they are defending on the narrow front that proroguing is legitimate, doesn't interfere with parliament (the bills dropped seems to have raised concerns with the judges) and not a judicial matter.

The current (cautious) feeling seems to be that government is finding this harder then expected and that judges may allow this proroguing but warn Boris he is on thin ice and not to do a repeat.

====

-Sir Redwood says would be wrong for courts to have say on Brexit, needs to be parliament

-Leader of UKIP Richard Braine boycotts conference as only 450 tickets sold

-Adam Price wants Plaid to pledge to ditch Brexit rather then referendum, Caroline Lucas feels Lib Dem position is arrogant and risks aggravating tensions

-Hannan defends Cameroon but he never understood Brexiteers

====

-Katy Balls oil prices a real problem for Boris

-John C.Hulsman needs to have a lie down and US trade deal could make Brexit great

-Emma Burnell Labour students and vacuum in the Labour right
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Re: UK Politics

Unread postby Dong Zhou » Thu Sep 19, 2019 6:47 pm

Brexit
-Papers on all sorts of things, Brexit, heckle, Rees-Mogg or world news

-Nicky Morgan wants major woman sporting events protected for free-to-air like male ones, also looking at Paralympics, backs Ofcom review into how to help public broadcasters against streaming services

-Dr Lewis says investigation into Cobham suggests a change of attitude within government towards foreign takeovers in sensitive areas

-Prime Minister Buttell says he didn't mean to humiliate Boris and would have asked protesters to respect Boris if it had been joint press conference, is a friend to UK and respects Boris a lot, is sad that people have been hurt by what he did.

-Business Committee to summon Ofgem about blackouts and what it knew

-Boris NHS heckler is a Labour activist (was fury among Labour figures when Kuessenberg mentioned this but even the activist thinks she is correct to point out his political leanings) but number 10 have said Tory activist may well have said the same thing given what the activist had gone through that day, Boris says he was glad of the meeting and part of why he does these tours

-EU demands via Finnish PM Antti Rinne (believed to be President Macron behind it)Boris present plans within 12 days which would be on eve of Tory conference with UK calling that an artificial deadline, Barnier indicates not a fan of Stormont lock, European Parliament says Brexit deal must have backstop and willing to delay, retail groups meet with Gove.

Barclay says EU needs to compromise to get deal and like de Gaulle says they need to take a risk or two, government says it has shared confidential technical "non-papers" (as I understand it, ideas that aren't official position) with EU on backstop alternatives, Polish foreign minister Jacek Czaputowicz and foreign minister Péter Szijjártó dismiss Brexiteers hope they would veto an extension. Javid meets Irish counterpart Paschal Donohoe for third time in eight weeks with both talking of need to strengthen relations, Vadaker hoping to get stuff done with Boris at UN next week

-Rees-Mogg urges Brexit supporters to back Tory since they share the same goal to leave EU, Brexiteers owe Farage a huge debt and most important political figure outside parliament in 30 years. Was error to recline on green benches during debates, Brexit deal will be very different from May's and have to listen to DUP, denies misleading Queen

-Cameron says he sought Royal help (within constitutional limits) for Scottish referendum which I think we all guessed but I suspect the Palace wish he hadn't blabbed with Strugeon suggesting Queen might want to avoid a repeat next time, Osborne and Gove were against Brexit referendum

-Ronan Lavery not helping rebels case before Supreme Court by going way off topic, government declares it may try to continue prorogue even if ruled illegal, Sir Major warns Supreme Court it would be naive to believe Boris

-Pundits getting excited by polls showing Lib Dem level or ahead of Labour but it is just after Lib Dem conference

-Interest rates held with Bank of England warns delay and uncertainty will hurt economy as will no deal

-SNP announce independent review into contracts to new hospitals that went wrong and have withdrawn attempts with named persons act that courts ruled against, some feeling this is preparing for election

-Boris says troops were sent to Mali to get French to be nice to us

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-Blair says Lib Dems look a increasingly serious option for people to vote for and indicates he is starting to be pulled towards them

-One of the wifi networks in European parliament is "Farage is a lying traitor"

-Been well noted Dugher as said he is now unsure if Tom Watson might be tempted by Lib Dems

====

-Kuessenberg Brexit stand off
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Re: UK Politics

Unread postby Dong Zhou » Fri Sep 20, 2019 6:11 pm

Brexit, fall out from Cameron's Scotland comment, Corbyn
-Papers on Brexit, far-right and Palace fury with Cameron

-Juncker says he is not emotionally attached (after saying erotic connection) to backstop so can drop it if all objectives are met which has raised hopes of deal, Boris doesn't want to exaggerated but feels progress is being made while Cvoney says big gaps remain, Barclay meeting Barnier. Corbyn says comments that seemed against backstop were due to poor wording and accepts need for protections for an open border

-Paul Brand of ITV tweeted seem thing about the NHS Labour activist who met Boris. Seems he has got none of the abuse Kuessnebrg did by some on the left

-Corbyn and SNP says it was wrong for Cameron to ask Queen to get involved in Scottish referendum with Palace make clear their fury

-BBC's Maryam Ahmed parties Facebook adverts

-Corbyn doubts we will see an Irish referendum for some time but it happened, would take no position if it happened as up to Irish people, daunted at idea of being PM but determined to deliver Labour's program for government

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-Cameron with an unfortunate slip when he meant shouted at TV

-Reeves calls for everyday socialism as Labour model

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-Kuessenberg on state of Brexit play and what happens if there is a deal

-Reality Check on if Cameron right referendum idea wasn't just him

-Adam Parsons urges calm over Juncker's comments

-Robert Peston what happens if judges rule against Boris
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Re: UK Politics

Unread postby Dong Zhou » Sat Sep 21, 2019 6:09 pm

Labour conference preview
-Labour

-Good Or Bad Year: Bad of late. Election results, local, by-elections, Europe have gone badly in recent months, polling very badly recently, the chaos on Brexit has grown worse and worse with divides now pretty much Corbyn's cabinet led by Watson and the members vs Corbyn, his advisers and likes of Trickett, the attempt to find the middle ground has not worked and it seems to be damaging Corbyn with members and risks damaging "honest Corbyn.". Corbyn has had a few tactical triumphs since return of parliament (then suspending) and Boris is giving him an easy figure to unite things, tensions between Corbyn and some in party have faded, helped by losing a fair few MP's this year, but not outright gone and they are stained by the ECHR investigating them

-What they need:

-Something positive to catch the eye, a sense of a government in waiting with a leader cutting through and fresh policies that will give that sense of substance. I imagine they will at least manage the third and have something positive planned to get the first, this isn't Corbyn's best sphere but the direction he plays his speech will be interesting

-Corbyn. He is polling badly, Labour will argue polls were wrong last time and Boris, though popular, may allow him to play contrast. To play the friendly adult in the room, more stable and honest then Boris, someone who would respect democracy and the system but wishes to reform it to be better. He has had some boosts of late in terms of tactical wins in parliament but he needs to find a way to cut through again to public, to rally Remainer Corbynites and to reach out to the middle voters.

-Unity: Always a tricky thing these days and the splits between Corbyn and his MP's on many issues, Corbyn and his followers on Brexit are problems. It is possible Labour's strategy is instead of providing a "look I tolerate critics unlike Boris" is to go "I don't quite go as far" with recent moves against student body and Watson but seems like a tactical mistake. Seeming at least smewhat united would help at an election and Corbyn does need to win over a broad church for power.

-Need to find line on avoiding election: I share the concerns of others that, though I can understand why they did it, so far Labour's explanations for why they dodged election takes too long. Boris can just say chicken, Labour require a paragraph or two. That takes too long with time they don't get

-Brexit: The perineal headache. Labour activists back Remain, voters more lean towards Brexit, Corbyn is of Benitte Brexit tradition but his supporters are Remainers, most MP's are Remainers or soft Brexiteers, was never going to be happy fun time. Labour's position has constantly changed and adapted, seemingly pleasing nobody and the latest one hasn't either, there may be a certain logic to it but "you would create a deal you wouldn't support?" is one of many queries. Corbyn would, I imagine, want to have conference focus on other things but Brexit consumes all

-Niceness: Maybe the party that claims a kinder gentler politics can go without police and security needing to protect females, media and those of Jewish descent at the conference?


======

thoughts on Lib Dem conference, Labour Brexit disagreements, effort to remove Tom Watson, Islamphobia
-Papers on Thomas Cook wanting a government bailout

-Lib Dem conference thoughts Realized I hadn't done this. It wasn't bad, generally unified (or in a way that doesn't cause problems) bar a few pursuits about the Tory entrants, Swinson made a good speech but their timing was unfortunate, they needed attention but Boris bravely running away then Supreme Court badly overshadowed them. I don't think they have fixed the "beyond Brexit" things bar Swinson's reach out for green vote which they need to repeat for more then one speech if it is to catch voters eyes, I feel their Brexit policy is a bad mistake.

-McDonnell doubts Boris can come up with deal that would satisfy Labour so would have to be an election, Thornberry says Labour should accept Tory deal subject to it being put to referendum and going down middle of road risks losing both sides, Abbott says Corbyn's new position is one all Labour should get behind and stop using remain to undermine Corbyn. Vadaker given holy water for meeting with Boris with Ireland's leader wondering if he is meant to throw it over Boris.

Barclay says UK and EU have common purpose in seeking deal, Barnier says not optimistic but still determined, leaked memo from the European Commission says UK proposals fall far short of what is required to replace backstop and stop a hard border. Convney says mood music is better but any talk of being close to deal is spin, DUP suggests a North-South Ministerial Council could be way through deadlock

-Lansmann attempting to oust Watson by proposing post of deputy leader is abolished for first time since 1922, first attempt was ruled out of order as Watson was given no warning and away but expected to easily pass today and be put to conference, even Watson's side expect him to lose. The post has usually been a counter-point to the leader as far as I'm aware, also not aware of other leaders seeking to prevent this route of dissent either, does seem bad timing in a conference before a possible election to be seen trying to purge ranks.

Corbyn and team will argue Watson has been disloyal and is constantly on airwaves providing different line (on Brexit but on other matters as well), Watson's team will argue he was elected to the post and has been helping keep party together, that he has talked on issues that matter like Brexit and anti-Semitism, is well known (apart from to McCluskey). One does wonder how Labour's right and centre, who Watson has been working to keep in party, will react to this, some wonders if this may be the final straw for them.

-Baroness Warsi says Tories backsliding on Islamophobia and wonders what new excuse will be found to avoid dealing with the issue, former MEP Sajjad Karim says he got Islamophobic abuse including from a current senior minister, Kwarteng says there is an inquiry into Islamophobia but struggles to provide any details

-Thornberry says Boris recent insults shows a contempt for woman

-Gavin Williamson not happy so many children "bunked off" school yesterday to join climate change protesters, Kwarteng doesn't support taking time off school but praises energy and creativity they are showing

-Harman's local party not happy she is running for Speaker but Harman says she won't back

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-Caroline Lucas Green New Deal

-Streeting calls Watson removal attempt outrageous and destructive, Phillips calls it an attempt at control, to push out anyone with independent thought and Labour leadership should just admit they hate Watson

-UKIP leader Richard Braine refusing to turn to UKIP conference not earning goodwill, Neil Hamilton says Wales shows UKIP is still relevant and successful

=====

-Adler state of play in Brexit talks

-Johnathan Lis unhappy at language of betrayal

-Rosie Carter warns BME groups fear no deal Brexit

-Forysth (sun) Corbyn's Brexit plan won't work, Cameron bad unforced error and other things

-CNN Luke McGee British politics preparing for toxic election
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