UK Politics

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Re: UK Politics

Unread postby Dong Zhou » Sat Sep 15, 2018 12:33 pm

Didn't realize I hadn't posted yesterday

-The "last 6 months of passport, no entry into EU" will be for every passport in your life. Not just a one off

-Carney told cabinet no deal preparation went as far as bringing house prices down 35% in 3 years, warns mortgage rates could spiral, the pound and inflation could fall, and countless home-owners could be left in negative equity. However Chequers would see UK outperform forecasts, Brexiteers like Evans and Rees-Mogg dismiss this as project fear and Sun has turned on Carney. In public Carney has warned Brexit uncertainty has hit pay-growth and a bad Brexit could see interest rates raised, he has also made clear the 35% is not a forecast

-Bone says police once rang him to warn a social media post was claiming to be about the execution of his son, has also had death threats himself, home attacked, threats to his ex-wife, his children. Sickening

-May called Rutte as part of build up to next summit

-Labour minister Lord Beecham says Corbyn's recognition there was a problem with anti-Semitism was belated and it is disturbing people still deny there is a problem

-Abbott and Greenwood to share platforms with Willsman at Labour conference

-Raab admits he can't promise anything on roaming charges

-Road Haulage Association warns custom checks would add a 45 minute delay on average

-PCS general secretary Mark Serwotka says the anti-Semitism row is an Israel conspiracy to distract from their own atrocities. When people object to this, his union says he said anti-Semitism must be combated but I don't see how that absolves him from anti-Semitism

Marie van der Zyl, president of the Board of Deputies of British Jews, accuses Serwotka of "trading in conspiracy theories and stock anti-Semitic tropes", pointed out row going on all summer is Labour's fault and has demanded either Serwotka apologizes or TUC take action.

-UK's bulk interception powers ruled illegal due to lack of safeguards but courts say bulk interception is legal and UK hadn't abused it

-Abbott says migrants from outside EU would be treated same as EU ones, scrap the minimum income requirement for non-EU migrants, abolish 2014 Immigration Act

-Corbyn condemns failure to have buffer zones for abortion centres

-Court rules Electoral Commission gave misleading advice to Vote Leave on electoral law during referendum. Electoral Commission reputation taking a battering for this and Leave campaigners will now use this to declare they are 100% innocent

-Fury as Tory party whips MEP's to back Hungary government against EU and widely considered to be hypocritical given their attack of Labour for anti-Semitism.

-Thornberry says Labour will vote against any Brexit deal May brings to Parliament, will need to be an election in months as May's Brexit plan won't survive Commons

-Labour figures unhappy as British steel cut jobs
-Times saying MI6 believed Foot was a KGB informant. Foot faced such accusations in his life and successfully sued them in the 90's but they now claim to have a Soviet defector backing them, not sure press believe the Times are right this time

-Lessons in relationship and sex education will be mandatory for children from 4+ by September 2020.

-National Crime Agency says they aren't getting cooperation from Cayman islands and private schools need to do more due diligence

-Ruth Davidson says May's critics should be quiet and let her do her job

-Gove risks being dragged into Ian Paisley scandal as he was a keynote speaker at a Pasiley fundraising event that may have breached rules, Tories arguing Gove was unaware it was a fundraiser

-Sturgeon says she was bullied at school, her dreams jobs when young was lawyer or children's author


-Sir Cable urges Remainers in all parties to join them in creating a powerful movement and wishes to be a home for liberal, social democrat, progressive, or centrists, proposes if Scotland votes for indpedence then they must also have a confirmation referendum based on terms of the separation deal, wants SNP to come off fence on second Brexit referendum

-Freeman says end state of Brexit must be negotiated by May's successor ie he wants her out after Brexit day and then a leader from new generation (ie not in cabinet or Boris) as the young will want to see one of their own shaping their future and not the old guard, praises May for giving leadership to a rudderless ship. He will stand for leader if asked and if none of the best of the new generation don't run. I think one loses power of attack if one hints at wiling to be the new leader

-Farron asylum cases should be taken out of Home Office and allow them to work after three months

-Rees-Mogg says happy for May to stay as lack of majority means one can not lead the party effectively anyway

-Charles Walker wants an end to party conferences

-McCluskey says New Labour helped a lot of people but feels they never challenged the power, Blair is a consummate politician but due to being toxic and loss of confidence in him that if Blair left Labour, it might lead to a rise in membership (he wasn't being unfriendly, just giving what seemed an honest analysis. Not sure I would agree with him but this wasn't a hostile attack). Says Watson is in a dark space (might need to be careful there), doesn't seem to know quite what he wants to do, hasn't acted against Corbyn since failed no confidence to be fair, sorry he has lost Watson's friendship and says he has no wish to oust Watson

-Tugendhat says, when May steps down, a new generation should takeover and part stop banging on about Europe

-Land's End to be spelled with apostrophe on signs


-Forsyth (sun) big EU summit for May, Hammond's tin ear, May needs to explain Chequers to public

-Kuessenberg no deal Brexit, Katy Balls feels this set has been played well by government

-Simon Jenkins feels Welby has crossed the line

-Radhika Sanghani on sexist coverage of Boris affair

-Andrew Grice May has out manoeuvred Brexiteers but heading for blind Brexit

-Ben Glover argues smaller parties should focus on winning metro mayor posts
“You, are a rebellious son who abandoned his father. You are a cruel brigand who murdered his lord. How can Heaven and Earth put up with you for long? And unless you die soon, how can you face the sight of men?”
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Re: UK Politics

Unread postby Dong Zhou » Sun Sep 16, 2018 12:29 pm

-Ruth Davidson says she won't be PM as too much danger to her mental health, showing the scars caused by her self-harm when younger and says it is offensive that people simply expect she would leave her child behind in Edinburgh and move to London right after it's birth

-I think so soon after revealing she is a Worboys victim and a leading campaigner about what he did, Symonds deserves better then descriptions like "young Tory temptress" because she had affair with Boris

-Orban says UK deserves a fair, good Brexit deal, Hungry loves the British and have cooperated on many things. Possibly the one endorsement May did not want

-Government launches review into rail franchising

-May says she is irritated by constant speculation of her future, Brexit debate should be about country's future rather then hers, Boris language on Chequers was completely inappropriate, she is still a bloody difficult woman at the right times, second referendum a betrayal of democracy

-Sir Stramer says Labour would vote against a blind Brexit

-Gauke says current divorce laws out of touch with modern life

-Gove says Khan is trying to frustrate the Brexit referendum vote, Chequers is right deal but says a future PM could change it, EU needs to show flexibility and has eyes on summit, admits Chequers has meant he has to "acknowledge" some of his views expressed during referendum due to parliamentary numbers and negotiations. Says they didn't back Orban but took principled stand against EU interfering in internal democracy and need allies for bigger things, Carney is truly independent and first rate public servant and admits he has changed his mind

-Sam Gyimah on universities handling of mental health

-Welsh labour agrees to one member one vote for leadership elections

-Carney expects robots to take a 10th of jobs and will lead to a period of unrest


-Mayor Khan backs second referendum

-McCluskey says he has sympathy with those in Labour who contemplate leaving due to Corbyn as been there himself, doesn't challenge May had the most left-wing policy of the two manifesto's and says more about what Labour talked about that inspired, admits if he wasn't head of Unite he would call for UK to get rid of nukes. Feels Frank Field is an irrelevance and left party 30 years ago

-Jeffery Archer says if was a northerner, he would vote Corbyn

-Sir Cable says improbable he will be leader by 2022

-IDS says Brexit vote was binding and must be followed through


-Andrew Rawnsley on the Great Crash

-Rentoul on boundary review

-Paula Keaveney on Lib Dem conference

-Nigel Nelson Boris vs May, no deal and other stories
“You, are a rebellious son who abandoned his father. You are a cruel brigand who murdered his lord. How can Heaven and Earth put up with you for long? And unless you die soon, how can you face the sight of men?”
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Re: UK Politics

Unread postby Dong Zhou » Mon Sep 17, 2018 5:10 pm

-Boris says EU's backstop plan would see N.Ireland annexed by EU while Chequers N.Ireland plan would leave us within EU in effect, we would be acquiescing to foreign rule for first since 1066 (ah the famous surrender of Hastings) and is a rip off. Number 10 points out he signed up to this last December and stayed in cabinet for 7 months

-Times saying EU is ready to agree to May's N.Ireland backstop with Barnier to write a protocol text on technology for the border, Finical Times says EU considering having British officials checking goods to defuse tensions, would be a huge boost to May if that became official but number 10 seems sceptical

-Hancock hints at auto-enrolment pensions system being basis for social care funding

-Trickett asking government to condemn Orban

-May says Chequers deal or no deal is only option for MP's (MP's on all sides don't seem happy) as EU won't reopen talks, Brexiteer plan would create hard border 20 kilometres within N.Ireland, she has stood up and rejected EU proposals, people do not want EU nationals given special immigration status. When asked "Can you complete the sentence “Brexit is a good idea because ...” she answers "It will give the UK new opportunities" but dodges around if Brexit will make us better off.

-IMF warns of grave consequences of no deal like reduced growth, bigger deficit, fall of currency, doubts any deal can be as smooth as membership and so will be costs to UK and to lesser extent EU (feels this should be obvious to all but notes for some it doesn't seem to be), doubts all issues can be sorted by departure date, trade deals would only limit econimic hit. Brexit won't provide NHS cash boost immediately, is praying for a deal, 63 trade deals is unlikely to be done by March if no deal, imagines negiators on both sides would like transition phase extended. Productivity is also a major problem (and notes if politicians put same passion into that as they do Brexit, it wouldn't be such an issue) but at least Britain has a illustrious history and strong people

-Lammy said he was told he should be deselected for joining in anti-Semitism protest and, rather less shockingly, IMF shows we need people's vote

-Gardiner feels second referendum would throw government a life-line, denies plans are being made to replace Corbyn

-Labour wants a ban on telling people gender of child after early blood tests for fear girls would be aborted

-Hammond warns no deal would hit economy and unwind a lot of progress done since the finical crash, UK needs a close econimic relationship with EU. Number 10 doesn't endorse this as says have plans to make a success of every scenario, McDonnell urges Hammond to rule out no deal Brexit

-Herald poll says 64% of Scots believe immigration should be devolved. One wonders if they also welcome the border issues and controls that would have to come with that but also an issue for Westminster. Peter Kellner analysis for People's Vote suggests this January will be when demographics see Brexit majority turn into Remain majority as Brexiteers die off and a heavily pro-Remain youth come off age

-Barnier says Brexit deal is possible as long as single market preserved

-David Sterling, the head of the Northern Ireland Civil Service, warns no deal Brexit could make trade impossible for some N.Ireland firms, particularly in agri-food

-Labour being accused of suppressing a report into rape allegation relating to 2011 and the victim has said she had to fight for months to see the report in first place


-Bernard Jenkin, not a famed businessman or maker of cars, says Jaguar are making things up when they warn of job losses if no deal Brexit. Not heard his thoughts on one January plant now on 3 day week due to econimic headwinds

-Rees-Mogg says May should try harder for good deal

-Clegg says Chequers or no deal being only option is an insult to British intelligence, believes EU would be willing to extend talks, baggage of coalition means he can't be a Macron but thy should stop apologizing (a shot at Swinson) for those years

-IDS says Gove's can change later" is a cop-out and UK has to seal the deal they want now, May should recognise WTO is an alternative

-Lib Dems will oppose Chequers plan. Not sure that surprises anybody. Would allow migrant spouses an entitlement to benefits from their first day in the UK with no means testing, want a complete ban on single-use plastics within three years, would revoke article 50 if May's plan fails and EU doesn't agree extension

-Sir Cable hopes to persuade Stephen Lloyd (who has promised to carry out the wishes of his Brexit seat) to join rest of MP's in voting against Chequers, there are better alternatives, Chequers has huge hole by not covering services, promises no future coalition (feels like a silly promise), wants a £100bn "citizens fund, replaces inheritance tax with a tax on people's gifts through their lifetime, denies Lord Campbell's comments that he can see end of the road.

-Jo Swinson says in Coalition, Lib Dem's played too nice and lost too many arguments and they need to own their failures during that time, accuses Corbyn of supporting May in Brexit

-Ed Davey backs proposed Lib Dem membership rule changes

-Gina Miller says she won't run for Lib Dem leadership, asks journalists to stop saying she wants to stop Brexit and feels the phrase People's Vote lacks a sense of detail

-Creasy says Momentum is a faction rather then an ideas factory, deselection is not an effective use of time

-Housing minister Kit Malthouse says Chequers is fine for now and doesn't things in stone

-Lord O'Neill says he isn't scared of a Corbyn government

-UKIP backs no deal over Chequers (not a surprise)

-Osborne says he knows from his time in cabinet how unsympathetic Home Office (and implies May) was to child migrants in Calais


-Kuessenberg on where we are with Brexit

-Hardman on mood and lack of idea's in Tory party

-Rick Evans calls for public ownership

-Chloe Westley bemoans professional gossipers in politics
“You, are a rebellious son who abandoned his father. You are a cruel brigand who murdered his lord. How can Heaven and Earth put up with you for long? And unless you die soon, how can you face the sight of men?”
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Re: UK Politics

Unread postby Dong Zhou » Tue Sep 18, 2018 6:33 pm

Cable's speech: Calls on May to surprise us and back second referendum, admit Brexit has gone badly wrong, people feel sorry for her due to pressure she is on but she is putting her party's extremists above country. Describing Brexit as an "erotic spasm" for some MP's was not an image we needed (he fluffed the line so sounded like extoic, Farron quipped "An *exotic* spasm. Is that an anti climax?? (Sorry.)"). That was the pre-release, when actually the speech went out... not a fan. Bad backdrop of yellow, green and blue, the wording (like erotic spasm) sometimes felt clumsy and cheap, rambling and not flowing smoothly in links, awful when attacking other parties (had a nice line on Corbyn always managing not to know about nasty things his people do but then seemed to dismiss it as a minor matter so he could talk about Brexit).

Brexit opening felt like a rant, once or twice touching but not fully exploring interesting things like EU reform and failing to really build on Brexiteers aren't racist or managed migration, generally poorly delivered and played (bar a good Gove penalty shoot out joke) into his speeches weak points. On the economy was the only really interesting bit as he talked of what was wrong and his liberal green vision for it, a bit rambling yes but the economist gave a sense of a vision of investment and admitted to new taxes. Health, education and so on was meh, felt like nothing new to say and not well delivered but his talk of a wider movement was good, of being the party of moderates, of there being a base they can draw from was good though his appeal to said public felt a bit forced.


-Sun accuses Hammond of undermining May's negotiating hand and strengthening EU's

-Ofcom drawing up blue print of regulations for social media

-Sir Stramer feels people are being too causal about a catastrophic no deal

-Hammond says government has to listen to IMF's clear warnings

-IMF points out geography is an important part of who major trade partner is

-Migration Advisory Committee calls for more migration but doesn't want EU to be given advantage compared to other migrants (though acknowledges EU talks might require otherwise), remarks large scale immigration has not had the great wage downsides or the upsides both sides of immigration debate claim. Brexit has caused more damage to living standards via falling pound then immigration has, system should be less restrctive for higher-skilled migrants then it is for lower-skilled migrants, tier 2 skills cap should be lifted. No work permits for low-skilled work, migration alone doesn't solve social care issue

Lord Green of Migration Watch says MAC has ignored impact of immigration (despite the big analysis... on impact of immigration), business groups not happy at their views on low skilled migration, Cooper says she is puzzled at gap between their analysis and their proposals

-May vows to root out anti-Semitism (unless in Hungary I assume), some Jews fearful in this country, no contradiction between being Jewish and being British, one can criticize Israel without descending into anti-Semitism and mustn't be used as an excuse to descend into Jew hate, claiming Israel's foundation is a racist endeavour is abhorrent

-Javid says they will work with Pakistan on money laundering

-Train punctuality hits 12 year low

-Tusk confirms emergency November Brexit summit planned, warns catastrophe of no deal still quite possible

-Raab tells European press EU turn to compromise (Gernot Blümel, Austria’s EU minister says UK needs to compromise), EU's backstop isn't acceptable but welcome any new EU ideas for it,, isn't time for second referendum, timeframe means if Chequers is voted down then no deal likely

-Hunt spoke fluent Japan when in Japan. Wish we had more people with such skills for any country. Outside of that he says cautiously optimistic about chances of deal as not in anyone's interests for no deal and a lot of people have made political graves predicting May would fall before

-YoGuv poll has Don't Know at 39%, May at 36% and Corbyn at 23% for Best PM

-National Police Chiefs’ Council says no deal Brexit would make their jobs harder

-Ireland hiring 450 more customs officers for Dublin port alone

-McDonnell on Mumsnet seems him draw back a little from his past calls for direct protest against Tory MPs and condemns what happened to Rees-Mogg, defends Corbyn's son being his aide and points out he gets abuse for who is father is (both are, in my view, unacceptable), mother is the lady he admires the most and she advised him to always be kind, trying to get his head round both sides of trans/woman rights debate, hopes next Labour leader is a woman and wants job-sharing for MP's.

-Sky claiming BMW has agreed deal with unions for a month shutdown (as I understand it, is one every year but they have moved it) if no deal Brexit with company feeling no deal will last 2 weeks and then two weeks of frantic diplomacy to reopen supply lines


-Sir Cable says his party needs to be welcoming to others, accuses May of trying to intimidate her MP's into backing Chequers.

-Umunna talked to EU diplomats

-Lord Campbell says second referendum is a right for the people, remaining in EU would help us stand up against Trump and Russia

-Layla Moran mugs selling more then the leaders which is a first for a long time, she and Swinson seen as main potential successors

-Sky News wants a leaders debate commission like US.


-Behr not impressed by Lib Dem's chances

-Sir Curtice on public attitudes to Brexit and how they are shifting

-Hinsliff warns neither party can dodge immigration debate forever
“You, are a rebellious son who abandoned his father. You are a cruel brigand who murdered his lord. How can Heaven and Earth put up with you for long? And unless you die soon, how can you face the sight of men?”
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Re: UK Politics

Unread postby Dong Zhou » Wed Sep 19, 2018 8:03 pm

-May pledges 2 billion for social housing and people should be able to feel pride living in them, people should not disrespect those in it (Brokenshire says sadly aimed at wider society but many suspect she means those in her party). In separate interviews says she plans to stay on long after Brexit and is drawing up plans for fair taxes to fund NHS, Chequers will deliver freedoms people voted for, second referendum would destroy trust in politics. Been uprise at the change of tack for party of home owners while her accidentally crashing into wedding and taking photo with the couple has gone down well

-May writes about Brexit in German press

-Papers generally back Migration report, raising air pollution links to dementia

-Barnier says EU ready to improve it's Ireland border proposals but approaching moment of truth (October) with Brexit and border checks will still be needed. DUP has rejected his current improved proposals (Tony Connelly explains EU's plan better then I could and given they involve border checks, Downing Street has made clear they can't accept it either

-BMW has confirmed it's Oxford Mini factory would shut down for a month if no deal Brexit, Honda Europe says no deal Brexit would cost them tens of millions, no plans to move Swindon park and supports Chequers

-Inflation up to 2.7% though high price inflation at five year low of 3.1%

-Treasury Committee wants watchdog to intervene on online currencies and regulation brought in

-Labour hope to ban use of credit cards for gambling

-Gove says he is optimistic of deal

-Treasury Minister Mel Stride muses pro-Brexit faction might back Chequers for fear of second referendum.

-Tusk says Chequers has some positive things but other bits needs to be reworked, time is running out so talks must happen every day, aiming for mid-November summit

-Raab challenges Labour to rule out second referendum, Labour asks doesn't he have more urgent tasks

-Hammond believes May can use Salzburg to bypass Barnier and will get a better reception that way. I suspect that will just anger the EU leaders

-European Airports have complained of Barnier blocking talks on aviation security with UK and warn they aren't ready for re-screening UK passengers

-Sebastian Kurz, the Austrian chancellor and Salzburg host, says both sides need to compromise


-Lammy on the idea that second referendum would be dangerous

-Davis says he will vote against Chequers as it is devoid of democracy and remarkable to see such an unpopular government plan, describes Gove as clever but clever men sometimes miss the obvious, Salzburg meeting will be warm words to May but she gets little, EU would benefit from UK being an economic competitor

-Lord Kerr says those hoping for second referendum have high bar has government control timetable but government has already lost twice so referendum MP's need to take advantage of opportunities

-Mayor Marvin Reeves really does not like the Greens

-Momentum says they won't block conference debate on Brexit


-Iain Watson on Labour's democracy review

-Heather Stewart with an interesting look at how Labour's Brexit strategy has evolved

-Toynbee Labour's internal wrangles need to be stopped by Corbyn and back second referendum

-Emilio Casalicchio Lib Dem attitudes to Cable's membership idea

-John Ashmore on migration report, Dominic Cascani looks at the figures
“You, are a rebellious son who abandoned his father. You are a cruel brigand who murdered his lord. How can Heaven and Earth put up with you for long? And unless you die soon, how can you face the sight of men?”
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Re: UK Politics

Unread postby Dong Zhou » Thu Sep 20, 2018 5:45 pm

-Malta's PM Joseph Muscat says most EU leaders are hoping for the impossible: a second referendum, Czech PM Andrej Babis says deeply unhappy about Brexit and wants a second referendum, Macron praises May's brave step but says EU won't compromise on it's principles and Chequers is currently unacceptable while lays into Brexiteers for lying to public then running, Orban says UK shouldn't be punished for it's Brexit principles. Vardaker says May is working hard on Irish border but they are no closer to an agreement then they were in March, Merkel warns much needs to be done by October but common market principles must be upheld, Rutte says EU better prepared then UK for no deal and while progress has happened a lot more needs to be done, Spain hopeful Gibraltar issue can be settled in October.

-Review of British railway troubles found nobody took charge of timetabling and operators hadn't prepared properly for anything going wrong, Department of Transport didn't do it's oversight duty

-Tory MP memo leaked, suggesting plan is to oust May in April and running a line about potential candidates

-May says unless solved in two months, she will walk away from talks, reaffirms her priorities including N.Ireland promises new proposals but EU needs to rethink their attitude to that issue, EU reaction after Slzburg is just negotiation tactic

-Alarm for number 10 as the loyal Mike Penning, who didn't complain when sacked, tears into Chequers as dead as a dodo, May is deluded if she thinks Brexiteers will vote for it

-Sturgeon calls for Brexit to be delayed to avoid a Blind Brexit

-Recall petition fails against Ian Paisley Jr. Given what he did, this either speaks ill of the recall petition system or the local parties. Paisley is not showing humility

-Labour want a ban on gambling adverts during sporting events, hinting it will take action if Prem clubs don't end gambling sponsorship

-Irish sources claiming May told Vardaker that October summit is too soon for a deal

-Retail sales up by 0.3%

-Conveney optimistic a deal can be done but warns there has to be a backstop

-Dr Fox denies he plans to scrap food standard rules to ease trade

-Tusk rules out UK plan on trade as undermines single market, October will be moment of truth to know if they is enough to do deal by November (edit, expected around 17/18), both sides need to compromise and he is a little bit more optimistic but no deal is possibility,, need guarantees on Ireland

-General sense is Salzburg is a disaster for May, her tactics have backfired and any hopes of moving things on has failed and been surprise at how brutal some of EU were


-Dame Hodge urges people to boycott Starbucks over taxes

-Moon argues MOD should not be immune from prosecution if it gets solders killed by MOD errors

-Andrew Murray seems to deciding best way to deal with misuse of Commons passes is to declare a conspiracy about the deep state being against Corbyn

-Davis says pound will fall if no deal and would be a bumpy period but confident UK can cope, EU's stance on Irish border is hypocritical, EU has had many successes and doesn't think other countries will depart so EU should stop trying to show it's strength by punishing UK, we can be global force for free trade

-Deutsche Bank predicts recession for UK if no deal

-Edit: Shapps says Salsburg is making him keener on no deal


-Kuessenberg neither side willing to ditch principles on Irish border, Robert Peston on Salzburg humiliation, Henry Newman suggests how to play this at conference

-Owen Jones calls for a more democratic Labour like reselection of MP's

-Aditya Chakrabortty on the university mis-selling scandal

-Rod Liddle (sun) why is left ignoring exploitation of migrants(rest is not politics bar an out of date Irish border bit at end)

-Christine Howard explains Momentum barring Sun from it's festival
“You, are a rebellious son who abandoned his father. You are a cruel brigand who murdered his lord. How can Heaven and Earth put up with you for long? And unless you die soon, how can you face the sight of men?”
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Re: UK Politics

Unread postby Dong Zhou » Fri Sep 21, 2018 4:56 pm

-May makes emergency Brexit statement after delay that was originally thought to be power in number 10 but was apparently a tech issue with TV companies.

Her delivery is poor for awhile bar a firm and sharp warning she will never risk the union of UK but her short, clearly frustrated speech wasn't badly written, some of it feels like an effort to clarify to EU why UK is digging in, where she feels EU has been wrong and setting the narrative. She also makes clear that her treatment at Salzburg feels like it crossed the line. It also may well work as changing the narrative after what had felt like a humiliation for her, wasn't a game changer in terms of Brexit or (bar EU migrants bit) offered anything new.

She acknowledged this stage of talks can get heated as a playdown of tempers but despite progress and goodwill, talks stuck at two points. She set out EU has offered two unacceptable paths on trade, EEA that wouldn't respect referendum result by putting UK under all the rules or basic trade deal which risks breakup of UK and makes clear that this is a real red line, both of which is a bad deal and worse then no deal. There has been a feeling that UK and EU simply don't understand each other on Irish issue and maybe setting out why it is unacceptable and giving a strong sense of the feeling she has on the issue. She had offered a third path, EU can't at this stage simply go no but need to set out in detail why they don't like it and bring forward alternatives. Sets out the second issue is N.Ireland, again why EU backstop cant work but EU might be annoyed at May saying she will bring forward alternatives given her complaints about point 1. Says she has respected EU and sought to do nothing that would harm the EU's integrity and wants EU to respectfully do the same

Turns to domestic concerns about no deal where she promises EU migrants will be protected, UK will do all it can to stop N.Ireland returning to a hard border, she also made clear (less domestic) that she will not overturn the democratic will of the people and doing anything else would undermine democracy, gave a firm tone. Then she made clear that UK had sought to treat EU well, with courtesy and respect but UK expects the same from EU.


-More then one journalist feels that May was clearly angry when doing post-Salzburg press, press agree it was a disaster for May bar the Sun who accuses Macron and Tusk of being EU mobsters

-Paisley says he is stunned and humbled by surviving the recall petition process, calls it a miracle but says clear public has accepted his apology and he "humbly accepts" their wish for him to continue. DUP allowing him back in. A sad sad day

-Grayling says there will be no deal if EU doesn't soften on N.Ireland as no UK government can accept that position

-Dodds says EU is being inflexible and UK must stand up to them, feels EU is negotiating in bad faith

-Corbyn won't rule out a second Scottish independence referendum if he was PM, would decide at time if Sturgeon asked and would argue referendum is a bad idea when Scotland has other priorities like child poverty. In response to May's speech says no deal isn't an option, May should change tactics but also accuses EU of playing political games

-BBC Monitoring on Europe's papers reaction to Salzburg

-Government adds more money to tackle poaching in Africa and south-east Asia

-Security Minister Ben Wallace says Andrew Murray really not that important to intelligence community as to go leaking to Mail, Tom Watson says Murray needs to bring forward evidence or else it is fake news

-Compostable cutlery, coffee cups, salad boxes and straws being used by Parliament to stop single-use plastic, ending selling bottled water and using condiment sachets

-Tusk seems to troll May over cherry picking and cake on Instagram

-Raab says if EU keeps rebuffing Chequers without detailed reasons and questions their seriousness, light will shine back on EU as to why, EU hasn't reciprocated UK's hand of friendship and feels EU has handbrake on, has been good news. I felt he handled his brief well on Brexitcast with humour as well

-Rumours a cabinet minister was going to resign but Chequers got such a kicking in Salzburg that got cancelled

-Ruth Davidson says May has reassured her of intent to get deal

-Mordaunt welcomes reassurances about EU migrants but warns EU their behaviour has increased support for Brexit

-Leadsom issues pledge of loyalty to May

-Sturgeon says May's statement was dreadful and her tactics have been hugely damaging, UK knew what EU's position on Chequers was going into summit so clearly hadn't been listening properly, need to stay in single market and customs union

-UK August Deficit double expected at £6.8 billion but still expected to meet year's forecast


-Davis points out European Research group has enough numbers to defeat May on Brexit since she won't get Labour support

-UKIP vow to be populist, standing up against the thought police and political correctness BBC mentions some of their new policies

-IDS says Macron is wrong, should butt out and stop trying to bully UK, Rees-Mogg wonders if Macron is trying to turn French eyes away from his bodyguard scandal then after speech said May has shown steely resolve against EU that was not acting in good faith

-Lib Dems want parliament recalled after May's speech


-Kuessenberg on devastating Salzburg, Katya Adler on EU perspective,

-Gabby Hinsliff on need to learn a language

-Gary Younge on Windrush

-Ian Birrell on Grayling, Christian Wolmer (sun) on wider issues with trains though also not impressed by Grayling

-Dan Bloom with 13 things from UKIP conference
“You, are a rebellious son who abandoned his father. You are a cruel brigand who murdered his lord. How can Heaven and Earth put up with you for long? And unless you die soon, how can you face the sight of men?”
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Dong Zhou
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Re: UK Politics

Unread postby Dong Zhou » Sat Sep 22, 2018 12:56 pm

-Thornberry says Corbyn has been distressed by accusations of being anti-Semitic

-Brexit press loving May's stand, even those not so keen call May defiant and firm, but Telegraph warns she faces a difficult cabinet meeting with Morduant tipped to resign

-Tusk says compromise on Brexit still possible, he admires May but UK had been the uncompromising ones, her econimic plans would risk undermining single market, her proposals had been treated with all seriousness

-McDonnell says Labour could renationalise railways within five years of getting power, would create Public Ownership Unit in Treasury to concentrate on nationalization, would be ready on day 1 to manage economy

-Labour conference slogan is "Rebuilding Britain, for the many, not the few"

-Butler promises equality would be central theme of conference and Labour would have a department for Women and Equalities, would make it a requirement for all employers to have a domestic abuse employment policy and provide 10 days' paid leave for victims

-ECJ to rule if Brexit can be halted

-Corbyn has had to defend Labour's disciplinary process over their handling of the Jim Dempsey case amidst concerns they didn't talk to the victim+the sheer length

-Electoral Commission seeking to appeal the Vote Leave judgement

-Nicky Morgan concerned at more banking IT issues


-Bridgen says things are grim and May will have touch time when she realizes how unpopular Chequers is with everyone including her own party

-Farage urges UKIP to reject Tommy Robinson or risk mineralisation


-Freedland on May's speech and warns Remainers a referendum alone isn't enough to stop Brexit

-Michael Chessum wants Labour to back second referendum

-Forsyth (sun) May damaged by Salzburg, preparing for conference, immigration, May's inner cabinet and others
“You, are a rebellious son who abandoned his father. You are a cruel brigand who murdered his lord. How can Heaven and Earth put up with you for long? And unless you die soon, how can you face the sight of men?”
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Dong Zhou
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Re: UK Politics

Unread postby Dong Zhou » Sun Sep 23, 2018 6:08 pm

-Corbyn, Watson (who wants it in manifesto) and McDonnell says they will back second Brexit referendum if members (Observer/Youguv poll has 86% wanting one) demand it. Sounds big but may depend how the Brexit conference motion is actually phrased

-Dawn Butler wishes a return to Militant Liverpool of the 1980's and for breaking the law rather then breaking the poor

-Raab says we need to keep calm and need to keep pressing to get a clear understanding of what EU objects to, dismisses rumours of an autumn general election, Macron's language was not friendly of a statement, EU's tendency to ignore referendum's has partially led to rise in populism

-Labour pledges to force boards to appoint employee directors to a third of the board and a levy on second homes

-Corbyn wants May to make a statement to Parliament on Salzburg and her statement, maybe bad phrasing on Marr but seems against trade deal with USA, denies his proposal for Brexit is also cherry picking, would vote down May's deal if doesn't meet tests. Won't quite commit to be leader till 2022 at least but gives sense he plans to be around awhile, dodges around Butler's Militant comments but says she was praising the determination and fight of people of Liverpool, keeping rate income is unfair on some councils, maybe a woman leader would be a good idea.

Denies being anti-Semite, says Jews have first say on who is an anti-Semite but when asked about Jews like Dame Hodge,Lord Sacks (calls those comments hurtful, beyond excessive and seems quite angry) and those who complain about his 2013 comments, says they are wrong so doesn't seem to add up. Refuses to say he wouldn't go to commemorations of those in Black September but says he doesn't support them, says founding of Israel is not a racist endeavour and Israel should end siege of Gaza. He needs a better answer to "your proposal to NEC is what you really think" ie foundation of Israel being a racist endeavour, asked to face to camera and apologize to Jewish members he goes on a defence of how anti-racist he is and party must be welcoming to all. Not an apology.

-Tom Watson not embarrassed at not being given speaking slot, says he gave it up for Labour MEP's, Labour is institutionally anti-racist, highly likes he would vote remain if there is a second referendum, mandestory reselection would be very destabilizing

-Long-Bailey concerned second referendum question could be skewed by government, has reservations about second referendum and doubts most people want anything more then Brexit to be got on and done with, doesn't seem keen on being deputy leader

-Next tranche of no deal papers on Monday. Surprised pre-Tory conference and during Labour conference

-Downing Street denies Sunday Times claims they have contingency plans for a November election and May plans to stand down next summer

-Mail on Sunday saying one unnamed Labour MP may be about to be given given 24 hour armed guard aka Home Secretory level which would be unprecedented.

-Man arrested for alleged abuse towards Joan Ryan

-Hunt urges EU not to mistake British politeness for weaknesses,, Tusk needs to rev down after Salzburg and urges EU to step back from abyss of no deal and engage with Chequers, he prefers Chequers over Canada style deal due to Irish duty

-Convney says Barnier has told 87% of Brexit has been agreed, concerned at DUP veto on Irish issue and fears talks could become unionist vs republican. French minister for European affairs Nathalie Loiseau says they believe good deal still possible but needs to prepare for no deal and EU can't give UK something that would bankrupt EU, German deputy foreign minister Michael Rot says working for sensible solutions and EU can't be blamed for UK's issues

-Reeves promises to ratchet up Business Committee inquiry into executive pay

-Labour NEC to create another deputy leader which will be female

-Rayner says she will turn her back on Gove's reforms (joking that is always a way to get back an audience), educational establishment are heroes and Gove made a mistake calling them the blob (working class having the worst literacy and maths in western world makes them heroes?), accuses May of dogwhitle during post-Salzburg speech, May's tone wrong in talks. Davies was wrong choice for Brexit and they have have copied Stramer's stance of principles first, working class want hand up not hand out and a lot in Westminster bubble don't understand the concerns. Wants an end to anonymous social media accounts and their reply of politicians should accept a higher threshold of abuse is unacceptable, has suffered sexual abuse. Likes the fiery pit of Westminster and gets worried when Tories don't shout at her, people feel political class are managing decline, admires Corbyn's integrity

-Jewish Labour Movement rally not happy: Dame Ellmann accuses certain union leaders of smearing Jews and of entering dangerous waters by blaming Jews for anti-Semitism, Streeting says union leaders comments create an atmosphere that allows anti-Semitism to fester, Berger says Serwotka was engaging in Anti-Jewish conspiracy theories. Ian Austin says it is nonsense that the issue has been weaponized against Corbyn and remarks "The truth about Jeremy is that he is much angrier with the people complaining about anti-Semitism than he is with the people responsible for it." Jon Lansmann argues "As socialists it is difficult for all of us to have to accept that we have a problem with any form of hatred in the party. I would welcome now a period of calm and reflection, I hope that Jewish communal organisations will now re-engage with the party.


-Momentum wants members to vote for debates on Windrush, schools, Palestine (that could go horribly wrong) and housing, arguing unions will ensure Brexit is debated anyway

-IDS and Patel (sun) o Salzburg and Brexit

-Kate Hoey says second referendum would be an insult to voters, Brexiteers won't allow result to be stolen from them

-Farage says no deal is no problem and would prosper, majority of political class not respect result and negative narrative needs to be countered, Brussels is a bunch of gangsters, Chequers doesn't work for anyone

-Davis dismisses Chequers as a weak compromise and Brexit should not be diluted, EU has treated May with contempt

-McCluskey against Remain being on second referendum and (fair point) warns Labour that some didn't vote Labour as they didn't quite trust Labour to deliver Brexit and they can't afford to do anything to further that. Some of Corbyn's critics have shunned opportunity to join transformation of the country and asking to be deselected, leaning towards Labour having candidates in N.Ireland, urges people to accept compromise on selection of candidates for sake of unity.

-Scottish Labour leader Richard Leonard says they will put in manifesto that they won't hold another Scottish referendum

-Nandy proposes Green like job sharing for leadership


-Nick Cohen on loss of compromise

-Rawnsley British mistakes at Salzburg and aftermath

-Peter Hitchens on Norway option, council housing and other matters

-Iain MacWrighter in despair over Brexit

-Rentoul not happy with how naval gazing Labour are

-Steve Howell warns second referendum is a bad idea
“You, are a rebellious son who abandoned his father. You are a cruel brigand who murdered his lord. How can Heaven and Earth put up with you for long? And unless you die soon, how can you face the sight of men?”
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Re: UK Politics

Unread postby Dong Zhou » Mon Sep 24, 2018 5:16 pm

McDonnell's speech: With a sore throat, McDonnell's speech only lasted about 25 minutes, his knowledge of his throat seemed to make him rush his delivery which led to errors but (bar the bad jokes, has a good sense of humour but not in speeches) better that then voice failing. Started by taking a shot at the press attacks during the summer and praising Corbyn's dignity under attack (also unwise as media love to talk about themselves and it can distract from speech), he failed to mention anything about how anti-Semitism might have something to do with the bad summer. Made clear his intent to bring back clause 4, attacks on Tories including end summary of being prepared for election were weak but I thought his "destroying dreams" was a good punch point they should use. New ideas? The good ones were already pre-announced, a few reviews and ending tax avoidance by shareholder campaign seems a really weak idea unless he has something more formidable in mind for when they fail, some idea's felt old.

What was good was building a narrative: started with the great crash, he cited figures like Welby (he might not be thankful), John Smith, the Co-Op, Gordon Brown, Shankley (he is in Liverpool), citing democratic efforts of past to give a mainstream appeal, he sold his ideas as democratising things like water (which he carefully made clear would not end up under Whitehall office and water bosses would have to reapply for jobs) or companies, always an elite. Fair play he actually talked about global systems which can get ignored in these kind of speeches, of changing the Treasury to be no longer London biased for spending. Argued shadow chancellors had been cautious by saying state of economy means we won't be able to be radical but argues the more difficult the situation, the more radical one must be so he won't do the same, spoke briefly but well about why people rebelled with Brexit vote.


No deal papers: Confirmed that if no deal and no side deal then planes will be grounded so UK would just offer EU countries access and hope they all do likewise. Pet owners would need four months preparation to be allowed to bring pets with them, bus and coach services to EU could be suspended, chemical exporters and mineral water industry would have trouble selling, passengers may be rescreened when they get to EU. Processed food-makers would have to have EU and UK address, livestock hauliers will have far more red tape and health checks, UK hauliers could be banned from EU.

I vaguely recall planes issue coming up during referendum, must be Brexiteers warned this this was a possibility...


-Note to political parties, if having a big meeting you might want to ensure it doesn't overun to point that journalists will miss the big finale of a show they love (Bodyguard in this case). It will not put them in a good mood

-Berger given police escort to Labour conference. #kindergentlerpoltics

-Javid suggests limitless access for EU access for more then two years. Not gone down well with some with IDS calling it bizarre

-Telegraph suggests cabinet, led by Hunt, uniting behind Canada style Brexit deal (CBI not happy)

-Labour proposes shares be given to employees (up to £500 worth) by law with 10% max to be given over to such schemes (CBI really hates this one), landlords would need reason to evict tenants, ban new free schools and academies, a £20 million renters union fund, would halt Universal Credit roll-out till issues are fixed, scrap benefit sanctions system, new national Substitute Teacher Register to try to bring costs down. Scottish Labour would have land reform act

-Labour conference Brexit motion is not what Remainers would have hoped 'if we cannot get a General Election Labour must support all options remaining on the table, including campaigning for a public vote'

-Labour's eight debates are Brexit, Palestine, the economy, housing, schools, government contracts, in-work poverty and justice for the Windrush generation.

-Labour expected to have a reselection ballot at 33% threshold rather then 50%

-Morgan says Chequers is dead, Norway best option, lack of leadership debates was an error

-McDonnell says next leader has to be a woman, second referendum can't have remain on it, jokes celibacy would have been a problem for him as a priest, hints he feels calls for him to apologize for McVey comments are a trap. Says he wasn't disloyal to Blair but just policies (unlike Corbyn's rebels), is going for shareholding which is something Thatcher backed, will meet with CBI to discuss their concerns, tries to link Berger's security with need for all MP's to be safe after Cox (yet other MP's don't have this level of protection so not sure how that works), fears second referendum would revive a form of UKIP, use of nukes would be based o cabinet discussions and accepts he has lost the argument to lose the nukes.

-Gardiner says it is loony tunes to think government will call an election. Labour meanwhile have been calling for an election

-Frances O'Grady she Tory Brexit would destroy workers rights, people felt Brexit because they felt humiliated at work since 80's and were ignored

-Sir Stramer says May was deaf to warnings Chequers wouldn't work, in/out referendum still option which contradicts McDonnell

-Rees-Mogg says May is a woman of singular wisdom and she will recognize time to move onto Canada style deal


-Apparently McCluskey yelled out outside conference as a right-wing B word. Urges Umunna to stop the country club plotting and unite behind Corbyn, calls Mail and Sun racist, anyone who calls Corbyn racist (I wonder which section of British society he means) has lost all sense of decency and sense of decency

-Ian Austin suggests Corbyn ""stop thinking he is the victim in all of this and he has got to properly explain and apologise for his role and responsibility in the development of this (anti-Semitism) crisis."

-Berger concerned money meant for mental health care is being spelt elsewhere

-Ed Vaziey backs Staffordshire University doing e-sports courses

-Momentum disappointed at the "meagre" internal reforms

-Umunna seems to have misheard or read McCluskey's comments, I suspect he may have got it conflated with the lines about calling Corbyn racist "I've said it before and I'll say it again: I stand by what I've said on bullying and racism in the Labour Party and won't be bullied into silence by anyone,not least because my family have experienced racism too. Its non negotiable.If Len McCluskey doesn't like that, tough"

-Richard Leonard floats Scottish wealth tax


-Kuessenberg on why some in Labour not happy with second referendum

-Trevor Kavanagh (sun) begs Tories not to have snap election for fear of Corbyn, rails against immigration

-John Harris argues Corbyn is struggling because it isn't radical, is too conservative and stuck in past

-Paul Mason urges Labour to take Norway option and a second referendum
“You, are a rebellious son who abandoned his father. You are a cruel brigand who murdered his lord. How can Heaven and Earth put up with you for long? And unless you die soon, how can you face the sight of men?”
User avatar
Dong Zhou
Posts: 16047
Joined: Sun Apr 10, 2005 12:32 pm
Location: "Now we must die. May Your Majesty maintain yourself"


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