The "VS" Thread

[The Aristocrat]

To the above VS and the previous China one, I just want to say if history is of any significance alot of it isn't going to come down to the battle field itself but on the campaigns made throughout to gain support from the common people. It has been shown several times that the tide swings in favor of the one that the people are more convinced will help solidify China and bring it back to societal harmony.

That said, Mao Zedong has personally credited his victory in the Chinese Revolution to Sun zi and he was notorious for gaining support from the majority in China by spending most of his efforts aiding the peasantry. Sun zi is known for similar campaigns. Kong Ming is not. I'd say both are equal in military strategy so it would come down to that.

LIkewise with Zhu Yuanzhang and Li Shiming the CCP general was documented and well known for being corrupt and harassed farmers and was ultimately assassinated. His assassin became a folk hero. The emperor built up a loyal and skilled faction which helped him establish his power. In the short term I think Li Shiming would win but ultimately his brutality and corruption would be his undoing and cause his power to be usurped by Zhu Yuanzhang.

[Tien Lung]

Huang Di vs Greek god, Ares!

Huang Di is the inventor of martial arts. . . how well does he do? In like, a war, against Ares?

[The Aristocrat]

lol I'm gonna guess a god of war beats out a human king lol even if he is legendary.

[Tien Lung]

lol I'm gonna guess a god of war beats out a human king lol even if he is legendary.

Huang Di had been deified. Like Guan Yu.

[Liao Ce]

I was trying to think of someone in 3k era to "vs" against Shaka Zulu. He has an interesting skill set. He seemed to succeed at every level of war... as a skilled warrior, strategist, general, or leader of a nation.
But as I thought about who to compare him to, I suddenly thought about Sun Ce. Seemed like a perfect comparison to me. Ce was a leader who was also a skilled warrior and solid general.

So I ask...
Sun Ce -VS- Shaka Zulu

I'm not even sure who to say myself. Curious what others might think tho. Perhaps I'm over-rating one of these 2?

[Xia Kyoto]

Bruce Lee Vs Jackie Chan and Jet Li, all in their youthful primes.

[Boydie]

1st Viscount Nelson vs Sir Francis Drake, each with a top class crew and with First rate ships of the line. Now that would be some sea battle!

[Cao Chao]

1st Viscount Nelson vs Sir Francis Drake, each with a top class crew and with First rate ships of the line. Now that would be some sea battle!

This wouldn't be a particularly interesting engagement.

To be fair, Nelson was not known as a ship commander (though while Commodore aboard the Captain, he directly contributed to Jervis's victory at Cape St. Vincent). While Drake is more famous as a ship commander - Golden Hind - he is more famous for circumnavigating the world than for any singular naval action (though he was an admiral and fought during the Spanish Armada and did capture a heavily laden galleon off the coast of Ecuador).

I would personally take Edward Pellew, 1st Viscount Exmouth, over either Nelson or Drake in an one on one engagement using the technology of the Age of Sail.

[Boydie]

Good mention of Edward Pellew.

Sir Francis Drake was a great ship commander, the raid of Cádiz being probably being his most successful campaign, his tiny fleet destroyed, captured or sunk over 100 ships over a 3 month period and delayed the Spanish plans to invade England by more than a year, giving Queen Elizabeth I precious time to prepare, personally I think if Drake's campaign wasn't successful, I think it would be safe to assume we would be speaking Spanish today.

Sure Nelson wasn't not known as a ship commander, but he does have a lot of experience of being a ship commander, plus if you add his "inspirational leadership and superb grasp of strategy and unconventional tactics", he'd make a fearsome foe.

[Cao Chao]

Good mention of Edward Pellew.

Sir Francis Drake was a great ship commander, the raid of Cádiz being probably being his most successful campaign, his tiny fleet destroyed, captured or sunk over 100 ships over a 3 month period and delayed the Spanish plans to invade England by more than a year, giving Queen Elizabeth I precious time to prepare, personally I think if Drake's campaign wasn't successful, I think it would be safe to assume we would be speaking Spanish today.

Sure Nelson wasn't not known as a ship commander, but he does have a lot of experience of being a ship commander, plus if you add his "inspirational leadership and superb grasp of strategy and unconventional tactics", he'd make a fearsome foe.

You do realize that Drake's Cadiz raid faced little to no resistance and that most of the 100 ships lost were merchant and fishing vessels, right?

I'm not disparaging Nelson, but merely remarking that he never fought in an one-on-one engagement with any force of equal standing while a frigate or ship of the line captain aside from the Action of 19 December 1796 and the suicidal craziness that brought about the victory at the Battle of Cape St. Vincent (though the Spaniards were incompetent and ill prepared for fleet action).