History's Greatest Betrayal

Discuss historical events and information concerning any culture, time, or location in our world (or even the frontier beyond).

Unread postby Axel1917 » Tue Dec 21, 2004 12:37 am

RedOctober wrote:German Social Democratic Party


Indeed. It is good that Marx and Engels, although they did not like that name, did not decide on another one, given that the German Social Democratic Party, as they had thought could have happened, ended up being a failure.
"The peoples of the world will pay for the historic crime of reformism with new wars and revolutions."
-Leon Trotsky, The Revolution Betrayed, p.7
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Unread postby Harimau » Tue Dec 21, 2004 9:42 am

Sun Quan's great betrayal. :)

Of course, that event could be interpreted in many different ways and justifications, but i like this particular view, as its the one that seems to make the most sense to me.
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Unread postby Han Xin » Tue Dec 21, 2004 1:17 pm

crashman wrote:You're joking right? Their complacent army was happier to walk the streets of Saigon with flowers in their helmet than to fight for their country.

Funny, we're talking about betrayal, not the complatency of the SVN army. The US was never fully supported South Vietnam in its war effort, they transfered outdated weaponry to South Vietnam and restricted South Vietnam to south of the 17th Parallel. Plus the idiotic of the Paris Peace Accord allowed North Vietnam to have a standing army of nearly 200,000 troops in the south of the 17th Parallel meaning that the South would lost the war sooner or later. Great allied hey?
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Unread postby Omega52 » Wed Dec 22, 2004 10:10 am

Han Xin wrote:America betrayal of South Vietnam throughout the Vietnam War :evil:

Oh?
To my understanding we sent troops over there, 304,704 were wounded, 58,202 were killed 114 of those were killed in captivity, 766 were captured, and 2,338 went missing. We fought for you guys and fought some more and we were unable to win the war, you can't say we didn't help. We were losing so we had to pull out, thats the way it goes. Sure we gave you "outdated" weapons but that was because our soldiers were there using the modern ones, thats like you are dying of thirst and someone offers you apple juice and you reply "i don't like apple juice, get me orange juice".

I'm sorry, but I don't like seeing the men and women in uniform being so disrespected.
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Unread postby Xing Daorong » Wed Dec 22, 2004 7:52 pm

Pol Pot to the Cambodian government.


Wiped out over half of Cambodia's population and the rest of the world did nothing for 10 years, one reason why I hate the UN with a passion.
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Unread postby Han Xin » Wed Dec 22, 2004 10:57 pm

Omega52 wrote:
Han Xin wrote:America betrayal of South Vietnam throughout the Vietnam War :evil:

Oh?
To my understanding we sent troops over there, 304,704 were wounded, 58,202 were killed 114 of those were killed in captivity, 766 were captured, and 2,338 went missing. We fought for you guys and fought some more and we were unable to win the war, you can't say we didn't help. We were losing so we had to pull out, thats the way it goes. Sure we gave you "outdated" weapons but that was because our soldiers were there using the modern ones, thats like you are dying of thirst and someone offers you apple juice and you reply "i don't like apple juice, get me orange juice".

I'm sorry, but I don't like seeing the men and women in uniform being so disrespected.

I am not trying to be disrespectful to any US servicemen or servicewomen serving in Vietnam. If you readed some of my post here, you do realised that I am probably the most Pro-US asian around here. However, the Vietnam War was virtually runs by idiots in suits sitting inside the Pentagon who think that drawing an invisible line on the map at the 17th Parallel and the North Vietnamese would respect that.

The US transfered outdated weaponry to South Vietnam even when they could affort to give more "dated" weaponry to more peaceful countries like Thailand and Korea. For example, South Vietnam get its version of the F-5E over 2 years after Thailand got their and even the version transfered to the South Vietnamese Airforce were modify to restrict the range in which those aircraft can operate.
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Unread postby Kayzr » Thu Jan 06, 2005 6:34 pm

Mitsuhide betraying and murdering Nobunaga.
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Unread postby Guardian of Shu » Sat Feb 05, 2005 2:35 am

For your information, the US spent twenty years training and retraining ARVN. Every time we put ARVN in a major battle, independant of us, we failed, miserably. We didn't need to be there. We spent twenty years of blood and death protecting the Republic of South Vietnam, and yet, when we were unable to keep up the fight, ARVN surrendered in months! I would say that ARVN had no heart, and was afraid. If you remember the US stopped the Easter offensive, the Tet Offensive, saved Seoul and cleared the DMZ!
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Unread postby Mistelten » Sat Feb 05, 2005 2:57 am

The ARVN's complacency cost them their country. One account of a soldier on R&R in Saigon spoke of the "soldiers walking down the street with flowers in their helmets and not a care in the world."
An apathetic leader isn't much of a leader at all. Apathy, indifference, and laziness are marks of an unproductive person. Liu Chan was the personification of all of these things, and he was Shu's biggest traitor of all.
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Unread postby urbanterrorist » Sat Feb 05, 2005 3:43 am

Jesus had his Judas while Ceasar had his Brutus.

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