History Section: Quick Questions Thread

Discuss historical events and information concerning any culture, time, or location in our world (or even the frontier beyond).

Re: History Section: Quick Questions Thread

Unread postby Shikanosuke » Wed Apr 24, 2013 11:48 pm

Korin wrote:Yeah, 'debate' - I just don't believe just because you are 'big brained' - doesn't make you smart. Whales have the biggest brain in the world, but yet they aren't the smartest in the world.

P.S. those are from 2005, and is still relevant, BUT there's probably been counter attacks to those claims, probably.

edit: http://news.sciencemag.org/sciencenow/2 ... -more.html (link that I found on CHF)

but the picture on there actually shows they had slightly bigger brains and how it worked differently from us. I can tell it's slightly bigger or my eyes are playing tricks on me. But if you read the page there, you can tell that their brains are made different from us, kinda.



Those are indeed from 2005. And as I said, its a debate as there is no consensus yet. I haven't said that you were wrong, but I don't think we can say with authority one way or the other just yet.
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Re: History Section: Quick Questions Thread

Unread postby Aygor » Thu Apr 25, 2013 8:11 am

Korin wrote:Yeah, 'debate' - I just don't believe just because you are 'big brained' - doesn't make you smart. Whales have the biggest brain in the world, but yet they aren't the smartest in the world.

The dimension of the brain does matter, not by itself though but in proportion to the dimention of the body.
Still, the relation of brain size/brain structure/IQ is not fully understood and therefore having a big brain can't be considered final evidence for intelligence.
Back to Neanderthals, we know that they were likely to be smarter than sapiens not only becouse they had bigger brains but mainly becouse we know that they were the first to bury their dead, they painted caves, played musical instruments and were able to craft better tools than sapiens.

Your link is very interesting, I knew that Neanderthals' pharynx didn't allow them to coordinate enough sounds to allow them to use a complex language but that might be a consequence of their brain structure (if proved) not favoring language development in their evolution.
I would just point out that this would explain the advantage we had over them which allowed us to fill the initial gap, but that wouldn't take anything from their intelligence :wink:
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Re: History Section: Quick Questions Thread

Unread postby Korin » Fri May 03, 2013 4:36 am

Neanderthals are like sapiens, they were smart ones and they had dumb ones and a mixture. You can't say a species is 'smarter' at all, each species has it's own pros and cons. But also if they had big "smart" brains, where are they now? They probably made a grave mistake long long long time ago and they went extinct, and that's how we have upper advantage over them because we were 'smart' enough to avoid extinction. But each species is gonna have different level of IQs, it's not really the species that is smart or dumb, it's more of the individuals.

Anyways, I just want to say that you guys thought Cao Cao and Sima Yan had a lot of kids, check out Priam!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_children_of_Priam
68 sons and 18 daughters!
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Re: History Section: Quick Questions Thread

Unread postby Aygor » Fri May 03, 2013 10:56 am

Korin wrote:You can't say a species is 'smarter' at all, each species has it's own pros and cons.
But each species is gonna have different level of IQs, it's not really the species that is smart or dumb, it's more of the individuals.

There's that nice thing we call "average".
Not only I can say that a species is smarter than another, I can also point out that a weak minded human is usually smarter than an animal.
Korin wrote:They probably made a grave mistake long long long time ago and they went extinct

As Shik pointed out to you, the fact that no hypothesis about their extinction involves making grave mistakes should be enough for you to quit thinking that.
Korin wrote:and that's how we have upper advantage over them because we were 'smart' enough to avoid extinction.

An advantage is what gave us the chance to eventually take their place, not "being smart enough to avoid extinction".
As I already said, it likely has to do with the shape of our larynx compared to theirs but as I saw the condescension with which you replied to a similiar statement on CHF, I don't think you are interested in understanding the matter.
Korin wrote:Anyways, I just want to say that you guys thought Cao Cao and Sima Yan had a lot of kids, check out Priam!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_children_of_Priam
68 sons and 18 daughters!

Priamo has the advantage of being a fictional character over Cao Cao and Sima Yan.
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Re: History Section: Quick Questions Thread

Unread postby Korin » Fri May 03, 2013 3:15 pm

http://www.chinahistoryforum.com/index. ... -mad-king/

Stories were real? I hope so. Because Trojan War was real imo, but some of these characters may of not been.

http://www.chinahistoryforum.com/index. ... -children/

why would the authors give Priam this much kids? lool.

But if Priam was fictional, then what about the Trojan War? That was obviously real. Also Priam's personality is probably based off a real Trojan king, so yeah.

BTW-seriously, evolution shows we are animals, we are defo not plants or micro-organisms. Nobody can prove we aren't.
I don't believe in either Evolution or Creationism, I believe in Alienism, but evolution shows we are animals, and that's that.

Finally, you obviously haven't seen dumb people then--people who lack of knowledge so bad, they don't even know what they are doing rofl.

Also, don't diss fellow creatures on this planet, every thing that lives is smart and that's that, I BELIEVE that's a fact - because I think people have researched this and found out that everything that lives can be smart, but some choose not to.
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Re: History Section: Quick Questions Thread

Unread postby Korin » Fri May 03, 2013 4:10 pm

The Trojan War was very real - it's just some characters could've been fictional, like the works of ROTK basically lol. SGZ and RTK type of stuff, Trojan style.
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Re: History Section: Quick Questions Thread

Unread postby Shikanosuke » Fri May 03, 2013 4:31 pm

Korin wrote:BTW-seriously, evolution shows we are animals, we are defo not plants or micro-organisms. Nobody can prove we aren't.


We aren't animals by definition, but we do share similar DNA (IIRC) with all living things.


I don't believe in either Evolution or Creationism, I believe in Alienism, but evolution shows we are animals, and that's that.


Alienism? That sounds as surely absurd as Creationism is.

Finally, you obviously haven't seen dumb people then--people who lack of knowledge so bad, they don't even know what they are doing rofl.


I see dumb people all the time, it has nothing to do with their (or the human race's) underlying abilities to adapt. You seem unable to disassociate the two, as if non homo-sapiens were just retards who were so stupid they chose to lack the abilities to adapt.

Also, don't diss fellow creatures on this planet, every thing that lives is smart and that's that, I BELIEVE that's a fact - because I think people have researched this and found out that everything that lives can be smart, but some choose not to.


You can't admit the existence of 'dumb' people and then say 'everything that lives is smart'. The two statements are at opposite ends of the spectrum. Nor is it supported by any evidence, especially because the majority of living organisms on this planet aren't sentient so they lack both capacity and will. Lastly, you can believe all kinds of things are facts. But thats the cool things about facts, they are facts regardless of whether you choose to believe in them or not. Their being facts isn't contingent upon your belief in them, and unless you can support it (like your claim here) then it isn't fact.
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Re: History Section: Quick Questions Thread

Unread postby Aygor » Fri May 03, 2013 5:22 pm

Korin wrote:I don't believe in either Evolution or Creationism, I believe in Alienism

Again, evolution is a fact: get over it.
You believe in alienism? that's not even a thing :lol: believe whatever you want, but you are wrong.
Korin wrote:Finally, you obviously haven't seen dumb people then--people who lack of knowledge so bad, they don't even know what they are doing rofl.

:roll:
Korin wrote:every thing that lives is smart and that's that, I BELIEVE that's a fact -

Believing it won't make it true, you are wrong again but whatever floats your boat I guess.
Korin wrote:because I think people have researched this and found out that everything that lives can be smart, but some choose not to.

Not really, no.
Smartest animals have around the same intelligence of a baby.
Shikanosuke wrote:We aren't animals by definition, but we do share similar DNA (IIRC) with all living things.

We do are animals and belong to the animalia kingdom accordingly, we also share DNA with all living things, as we are branches of the same offspring so to speak.
Last edited by Aygor on Fri May 03, 2013 5:34 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: History Section: Quick Questions Thread

Unread postby Korin » Fri May 03, 2013 5:33 pm

Whatever, I was just meaning that Evolution shows we are animals, and the group of mammals which are a animalia group. We share more than just DNA, there's a lot--I'm going off my own knowledge as this is not my area of expertise. I know wikipedia can be edited by anybody but if you go to the mammal place, you'll see humans in suits in the center area or so. So it shows we are animals.

No, I believe anything that lives can be smart, as I let those religious people believe what they believe.

Lol, even babies can be smart you know, but I don't believe that because you are saying that a group of living beings are as a smart as a baby? That's just insulting, I can say that majority of human race is dumb because they are brainwashed by society/media. But I don't because I believe all living things can be smart if they choose to.

We are basically animals but the general public don't think that cause they all do is watch tv and work, for example. They don't care about this stuff, they just want to live. I care because I know we are animals, if we are not we are a plant or a micro-organism. LOL

Bottom line is that Mammals are warm-blooded animals, so that shows it. But I love my cold-blooded brothers, bearded dragons and iguanas 4 life!

I also heard people say stuff like 'Creationism is a myth' but who cares, I mean I don't judge it any more because Alienism (I made it up because I don't know correct term) is like the extraterrestrial venison of Creationism LOL
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Re: History Section: Quick Questions Thread

Unread postby Shikanosuke » Fri May 03, 2013 5:43 pm

Korin wrote:No, I believe anything that lives can be smart, as I let those religious people believe what they believe.


And you're free to believe that, but you're still incorrect.

Lol, even babies can be smart you know, but I don't believe that because you are saying that a group of living beings are as a smart as a baby?


No, babies have the capacity to learn but they really can only be 'smart' relative to their current capacity.

That's just insulting,


Luckily most animals don't have the capacity for understanding verbal insults.

I can say that majority of human race is dumb because they are brainwashed by society/media. But I don't because I believe all living things can be smart if they choose to.


Again, you can say whatever you wish..it just doesn't follow that its therefore accurate. Also, if someone is 'dumb' its unlikely its because they've been 'brainwashed' by the media. If someone is dumb its most likely due to a lack of capacity, lack of education, or mental deficiency. It's not because they tuned into some 'brainwashing media' that you think everyone (but you obviously) falls victim to.

We are basically animals but the general public don't think that cause they all do is watch tv and work, for example.


The general public isn't concerned whether or not we are animals because most people have little problem with it . Furthermore, none of its related to tv-viewing or gainful employment.

They don't care about this stuff, they just want to live.


Why wouldn't they just want to live? Why should they care that you want to scream at them that we're all animals? There really isn't even a meaningful argument here. I feel like your entire premise is based on semantics.

I care because I know we are animals, if we are not we are a plant or a micro-organism. LOL


You care because you know we are animals? I don't think thats a reason to care what people classify themselves as. Also, why is that funny?

Bottom line is that Mammals are warm-blooded animals, so that shows it. But I love my cold-blooded brothers, bearded dragons and iguanas 4 life!


Um, I'm glad you enjoy animals. 4 life.

I also heard people say stuff like 'Creationism is a myth' but who cares,


Now here's where I'm even more confused. You're pretty enthusiastic about yelling at people what their biological classification is (though we're still unsure why its important) but have no problem with people spouting pseudo-science and trying to pass it off to the public as fact. Who cares? Science cares and all rational human beings who don't want demonstrably false theories taught to impressionable youth should care.

I mean I don't judge it any more because Alienism (I made it up because I don't know correct term) is like the extraterrestrial venison of Creationism LOL


Ok. So first of all, you should be judging said theories. Secondly if you're going believe in a theory, even one which doesn't exist (such as your alienism) you might want to know alot about it. For instance, if it has a real name.
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