Chen Deng

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Re: Chen Deng

Unread postby Sun Fin » Fri Nov 11, 2011 4:35 pm

EDIT: It appears (surprise, surprise! :lol: ) I was wrong, there is another source that I was unaware of, which Rafe doesn't refrence in GoTS, which gives more detail on Chen Deng's victories.


Lady Wu I was wondering if you may have made a small, but significant, mistake in this translation?

I am referring to the fact that according to this translation that Chen Deng beat's an army of Sun Ce's rather than, as I suspect, Sun Quan. Now I don't read Chinese so I can't go the source but I can tell you why I think there may be a mistake. First of all no defeat is mentioned in Ce's SGZ. Second of all it says that Sun Ce 'sent an army', that’s not Ce's style. Thirdly it starts of talking about Ce’s army then straight after the description of the battle goes on to say ‘Because of this, Sun Quan was able to hold all the lands beyond the Yangtze.’ To me this would suggest that it was Quan’s army in the first place. However these are rather small things. More importantly is its exclusion from GoTS.

This section is the relevant bit:

In fact, in the summer of 200, Sun Ce rode to his last campaign. When he was in the west to fight Huang Zu and take over Lujiang and Yuzhang, the remnant troops of his old enemy White Tiger Yan had made another rebellion in Wu commandery, encouraged by Chen Deng, Grand Administrator of Guangling appointed by Cao Cao; himself a cousin of Chen Yu, the earlier nominal Grand Administrator of Wu commandery who had been driven away by Sun Ce in 197. Whether Cao Cao was directly involved or not, Chen Deng was evidently playing the same game as his cousin three years earlier, and the threat of disturbance in Wu commandery was a most effective means of keeping Sun Ce's attention safely in the southeast. Among the rebels there was also the former Grand Administrator Xu Gong, the man who had been driven from office in 196. Shortly before that time, when Sun Ce had defeated Liu Yao south of the Yangzi but before he had moved against Wu commandery, we are told that Xu Gong had written to the court to urge that Sun Ce should be summoned to hold office in the capital so that he might be kept under control. Then Sun Ce took the commandery and Xu Gong fled to the local leader Xu Zhao, and it seems he was able to keep away from Sun Ce until this time. In one of the early engagements of the new campaign, however, Sun Ce captured Xu Gong, taxed him with that letter to the court, and then had him executed by strangling. After this first success, Sun Ce brought his army to camp at Dantu, southeast of present-day Zhenjiang in Jiangsu. There, by the southern shore of the mouth of the Yangzi, he planned to wait a few days for supplies, and in the mean time he went hunting. However, though Xu Gong had been killed and his followers scattered, a few of them had taken refuge in the country nearby. Sun Ce loved to hunt deer, the horse that he rode was a good one, and none of his guards or attendants could keep up with the chase. For a little while, he was alone, and he came upon three of Xu Gong's former retainers. They seized their bows and shot at him, and one of the arrows struck him on the jaw. Then Sun Ce's attendants came up, and the three men were killed, but Sun Ce was brought back to his camp with a serious wound.


So yeah it’s not mentioned in Rafe’s description of the campaign. When combined with this footnote I’m lead to suspect you made a small error and instead it was Quan that sent an army against him:

‘There is a supplementary biography of Chen Deng in SGZ 7, 229-30, and the commentary of Pei Songzhi adds a long passage from a Xianxian xingzhuan, describing Chen Deng's later achievements in holding Guangling commandery against attacks from the south led by Sun Ce's successor Sun Quan.’
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Re: Chen Deng

Unread postby Lady Wu » Sat Nov 12, 2011 3:06 am

The original line is 孙策遣军攻登于匡琦城 (I checked a few editions of the text and they all say that).

孙策 Sun Ce
遣 send
军 army
攻 attack
登 Deng
于 at
匡琦 Kuangqi
城 city

There's also a Pei note in Sun Ce's SGZ saying "Ce again attacked Chen Deng", which to me implies that Sun Ce had attacked Chen Deng (either personally or through a deputy) before.
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