Cao cao or Nobunaga

Join the Romance of the Three Kingdoms discussion with our resident Scholars. Topics relating to the novel and history are both welcome. Don't forget to check the Forum Rules before posting.
Kongming’s Archives: Romance of the Three Kingdoms
Three Kingdoms Officer Biographies
Three Kingdoms Officer Encyclopedia
Scholars of Shen Zhou Search Tool

Who was the better leader?

Nobunaga
6
24%
Cao cao
19
76%
 
Total votes : 25

Cao cao or Nobunaga

Unread postby Dian Ziman » Sat Feb 21, 2004 11:20 am

People who I talk to through the internet often argue who was the better leader out of Cao cao and Nobunaga, since most of you here will probably have more knowledge of history than they do I would like to see your opinions.
Dian Ziman
Student
 
Posts: 93
Joined: Thu Feb 19, 2004 4:46 pm

Unread postby Jiang Zhi » Sat Feb 21, 2004 6:36 pm

Cao Cao :) he's more Machiavellian compared to the more tyrannical type Nobunaga.....
Jiang Zhi of Foshan, style Maodi
~*!越武帝!*~ - 我愛我的妻子孫尚香!
Nan Hai, Jiaozhou

Laconius Arts and Design My Rot3K fanfiction
User avatar
Jiang Zhi
Sun Shang Xiang's puppy-eyed slave
 
Posts: 3738
Joined: Sun Sep 29, 2002 3:07 am
Location: Sun Shang Xiang's bedroom

Unread postby Omega52 » Sat Feb 21, 2004 6:47 pm

Nobunaga
His army was much more advanced for his time in comparison to Cao Cao army in his time.
Obviously Nobunagas would be more advanced than Cao Cao's but I meant at a ratio to other world powers at each of their times.
"I mistrust the judgement of every man in a case in which his own wishes are concerned."- Field Marshal Arthur Wellesley
User avatar
Omega52
Scholar of Shen Zhou
 
Posts: 747
Joined: Fri Jul 26, 2002 2:11 am
Location: IPGA

Unread postby Ranbir » Sat Feb 21, 2004 7:41 pm

Nobunaga...
Legend has it he even made a pact with demons...I'd like to see Cao Cao try that...

Ok enough kidding, and the fact I've realised this is in the World History Deliberation section, not the pub.

I'd say Cao Cao, from what I know at this point, China seemed to be more of a troublesome country...(more chaotic maybe?)
"The imaginary number is a fine and wonderful resource of the human spirit, almost an amphibian between being and not being." - Gottfried Leibniz
Science snobbery.
User avatar
Ranbir
For Queen and Country
 
Posts: 8489
Joined: Mon Aug 18, 2003 9:27 am
Location: Your heart. <3

Unread postby Jiang Zhi » Sat Feb 21, 2004 7:47 pm

Omega52 wrote:Nobunaga
His army was much more advanced for his time in comparison to Cao Cao army in his time.
Obviously Nobunagas would be more advanced than Cao Cao's but I meant at a ratio to other world powers at each of their times.


We're talking about leadership, not military might.......of course Nobunaga would beat Cao Cao if it's military might sinec Cao Cao had no gunpowder back then.......
Jiang Zhi of Foshan, style Maodi
~*!越武帝!*~ - 我愛我的妻子孫尚香!
Nan Hai, Jiaozhou

Laconius Arts and Design My Rot3K fanfiction
User avatar
Jiang Zhi
Sun Shang Xiang's puppy-eyed slave
 
Posts: 3738
Joined: Sun Sep 29, 2002 3:07 am
Location: Sun Shang Xiang's bedroom

Unread postby Omega52 » Sat Feb 21, 2004 9:45 pm

Jiang Zhi wrote:
Omega52 wrote:Nobunaga
His army was much more advanced for his time in comparison to Cao Cao army in his time.
Obviously Nobunagas would be more advanced than Cao Cao's but I meant at a ratio to other world powers at each of their times.


We're talking about leadership, not military might.......of course Nobunaga would beat Cao Cao if it's military might sinec Cao Cao had no gunpowder back then.......


I meant relatively
Cao Cao army compared to the other armies in the world at his time and Nobunagas army compared to other armies at his time, since Nobunaga was about 100 years more advanced then any other army at his time, I'd say he was a better leader.

And BTW, I never heard anything about Nobunaga and Demons, except for in Onimusha.
"I mistrust the judgement of every man in a case in which his own wishes are concerned."- Field Marshal Arthur Wellesley
User avatar
Omega52
Scholar of Shen Zhou
 
Posts: 747
Joined: Fri Jul 26, 2002 2:11 am
Location: IPGA

Unread postby Ranbir » Sat Feb 21, 2004 10:14 pm

There are a few myths and legends relating Nobunaga to outwordly beings, it has been great material for stories and such. I can agree that maybe these myths are not as detailed as Onimusha has made them.
"The imaginary number is a fine and wonderful resource of the human spirit, almost an amphibian between being and not being." - Gottfried Leibniz
Science snobbery.
User avatar
Ranbir
For Queen and Country
 
Posts: 8489
Joined: Mon Aug 18, 2003 9:27 am
Location: Your heart. <3

Unread postby White Horse General » Sun Feb 22, 2004 12:30 am

Easy, Cao Cao.

Cao Cao was a born leader, few people can honestly be called a Villain by half a realm yet still be so charismatic to win over such great talent. He was well versed in his battle tactics and strategies, heck I believe even the mighty Zhuge Liang commended Cao Cao for his abilitiy to conduct warfare.
Sings we a dance of wolves;
Who smell fear and slay a coward.
Sings we a dance of man;
Who smells gold and slays his brother.
White Horse General
Master
 
Posts: 224
Joined: Wed Nov 05, 2003 8:31 pm
Location: My Snorlax ran away....

Unread postby Lord Uesugi Kenshin » Sun Feb 22, 2004 1:27 am

Cao Cao that's not to say that there weren't daimyo who equal or better than Cao Cao infact I think he would of been hard pressed against such leaders as Takeda Shingen, Uesugi Kenshin Mori Motonari and Date Masamune. But what a lot of people don't realise is that Nobunaga wasn't as great as he was made out to be sure Nobunaga won at Okehazama but Cao Cao also won at Guan Du but the main difference is Nobunaga's empire was formed by destroying lots of lesser lords while Cao Cao came out on top against the big guns (Lu Bu, Yuan Shao) of his time.
"Guan Ping, my worthy nephew, it is strange that you do not recognize death when it stares you in the face." -Xu Huang

"Go to the battlefield firmly confident of victory and you will come home with no wounds whatsoever." -Uesugi Kenshin
User avatar
Lord Uesugi Kenshin
Tyro
 
Posts: 18
Joined: Wed Feb 18, 2004 1:37 am
Location: Australia

Unread postby Devilrai » Sun Feb 22, 2004 8:01 am

I knew that this kind of thread appear sooner or later...
Anyway this is a hard choice both were great leaders of their time of chaos, both should tremendous charisma, but Nobunaga was the closet to conquering all of Japan and he could have only if he didn't meet his unforunate death he could have conquered all of Japan. Though I like Cao Cao, but between them Nounaga was a better ruler, though I'm still debateing with myself but as for right now Nobunaga is the one.
User avatar
Devilrai
Scholar of Shen Zhou
 
Posts: 982
Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2003 6:09 am

Next

Return to Sanguo Yanyi Symposium

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests

Copyright © 2002–2008 Kongming’s Archives. All Rights Reserved