What if Zhuge Liang was a villain?

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What if Zhuge Liang was a villain?

Unread postby Koichi » Fri Dec 26, 2003 11:09 pm

:twisted: Let's have some fun. This is a "What if..." scenario inspired by the Berserk anime. Zhuge Liang keeps all the abilities given to him in the novel. The only difference is, instead of working to restore the Han, Zhuge Liang now fights only to advance his personal ambition. What do you think he would do? How would the other characters deal with him? Would the Sleeping Dragon succeed?

Once again I wish to remind everyone, besides his ambition, Zhuge Liang must keep all his other attributes.
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Unread postby Man Chong » Fri Dec 26, 2003 11:18 pm

Wel, I think that Zhueg would have to maneuver around the Tigers. Guan Yu/Zhang Fei/Zhao Yun/Huang Zhong/Ma Chao I doubt would join Zhueg.

Wei Yan could easily be baited with money/power I guess......

Now Ma Su/Ma Liang/Jiang Wei I believe would be with Zhuge Liang. But Sun Qian/MiZhu/Jiang Yong would be with Liu Bei/Liu Shan.

I believe that Zuhge could slowly taek control of the court from Liu Bei/SHan, using his charm/money/position to win over supporters. Soon, many of the pre-Zhuge officers will die off, and many of the newer officers would be ZHuge's supporters. Then he can take over completely.
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Unread postby Asellas » Sat Dec 27, 2003 1:55 am

Maybe he might have gone to Cao Cao? He was pretty villianous or claimed to be the most villianous emperor so him and Zhuge if Kongming was a villian then Cao Cao with no doubt have taken CHina much earlier beause two powerful minds would be at work.
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Unread postby Man Chong » Sat Dec 27, 2003 2:36 am

I doubt Zhuge would go to Cao Cao. If Zhuge had ambitions of his own, and as they say, "two tigers can't live on the same mountain"

I doubt Zhuge would want to listen to Cao Cao. And I doubt that Cao Cao would want to use someone as smart as Zhuge Liang.
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Unread postby Koichi » Sat Dec 27, 2003 3:38 am

Man Chong wrote:I doubt Zhuge would go to Cao Cao. If Zhuge had ambitions of his own, and as they say, "two tigers can't live on the same mountain"

I doubt Zhuge would want to listen to Cao Cao. And I doubt that Cao Cao would want to use someone as smart as Zhuge Liang.


I'm with Man Chong on this one. If Liu Bei paid 3 visits to Evil Zhuge Liang I believe he would still join. There is plenty of opportunity for the Dragon to advance in Liu Bei's ranks and opportunity to occupy Jing and Yi provinces.

Cao Cao's forces were of a different character. He already had a entourage of talented generals and advisors and it may be difficult for a commoner from Longzhong to climb the ranks. More importantly, Cao Cao was a centrist. He would not use a person he couldn't control. Potentially smarter officers than he (Yang Xiu) were in danger of their lives. Sima Yi only came to power after Cao Cao died. Zhuge Liang would know this and may not have the intention to enter a pasture already full of horses.

Remember :twisted: When Shi Guangyuan, Meng Gongwei, and Cui Zhouping were discussing their ambitions, Zhuge Liang only responded with a meek smile.
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Unread postby Starscream » Sat Dec 27, 2003 6:31 am

I'm open to the idea that Zhuge Liang could consider going to Cao Cao's ranks if he were truly ambitious. Cao Cao's power was the greatest among the three rulers and he had the emperor as the mark of power and legitimacy. If he truly wanted power, he would join the truly powerful in order to have a larger impact over China. I do not doubt Zhuge Liang's talents, so climbing up the ranks in Cao Cao's camps would be possible if he's as patient as Sima Yi. Firstly, he could join Liu Cong's surrender camp and merge with Cao Cao's forces prior to Changban. Then he could serve in the reinforcements in the battle of Chibi. In the peace times, he could be a governor of a commandery near the capital and before Cao Cao died, he could grab a coming opportunity to leave a good impression on Cao Cao to have a quantum leap in ranks. After Cao Cao died, Zhuge Liang would be free to manuever in the courts, only to face the likes of Jia Xu and Sima Yi. Nevertheless, he would have an interesting future. :wink:
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What if....

Unread postby Stedfel » Sat Dec 27, 2003 9:08 am

Zhuge Liang probably would have joined Liu Bei and would rise through the ranks. Then once Liu Bei was dead he would overthrow Liu Shan and become leader of Shu.
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Unread postby Six_and_Up » Sat Dec 27, 2003 11:10 am

Actually i believe that Zhuge Liang was already pretty much serving his own personal ambition. The only reason i see Zhuge Liang joining shu is the fact that he can pretty easily rise through the ranks and gain a lot of power. He also ensures that Liu Shan is next in line to the throne by killing off his only compeitition, Liu Feng. By the time Liu Bei is dead, Zhuge Liang is in complete control of Shu. Nowhere else was this possible. In Wu and Wei his just another advisor. In Shu his in charge of a sizable standing army in hanzhong, has an emperor that listens to him all the time and is seen as a righteous man upolding the last remanents of han rule.
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Re: What if....

Unread postby Shadowlink » Sat Dec 27, 2003 1:34 pm

Tsailiao wrote:Zhuge Liang probably would have joined Liu Bei and would rise through the ranks. Then once Liu Bei was dead he would overthrow Liu Shan and become leader of Shu.
:lol: that will never happen he is loyal to liu bei's dying word if he did overthroe liu shan he might have not been in much stress.
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Unread postby Sima Hui » Sat Dec 27, 2003 11:10 pm

I reckon he would have accepted the "Nine Dignities of Kingship" and made sure his son became Emperor. A lot like Cao Cao really... :evil:
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