Best/Favourite Kingdom (and Why?) Discussion

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Best/Favourite of the Three Kingdoms?

Wei
133
34%
Shu
157
40%
Wu
105
27%
 
Total votes : 395

Re: Best/Favourite Kingdom (and Why?) Discussion

Unread postby Dong Zhou » Fri Mar 20, 2015 7:20 pm

Both kingdoms were hard to take down if they were strong internally, they had resources and strong natural defences. To take Hanzhong seems to require luck or a defensive mess up for example and Wu had it's navy... Wu probably survived longer then it should have as Jin had a major Qiang invasion during the ten year gap
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Re: Best/Favourite Kingdom (and Why?) Discussion

Unread postby Hussam » Fri Jun 19, 2015 11:01 pm

Shu is my favourite, I think it was the most righteous.
I also get emotional when i read about victories and defeats of Shu.
I just love Shu :D
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و إن ما عطيوني ياكي يا جبال العالي لهدا
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Re: Best/Favourite Kingdom (and Why?) Discussion

Unread postby Xiahou Ren » Sat Jun 20, 2015 2:21 am

Wei. Because for some reason I see Cao Cao, Xiahou Dun, and Cao Ren to be far more humble and down-to-earth, compared to the three brothers. The three brothers just look like a bunch of elites who look down on everybody else outside their exclusive circle, in my opinion.

And this pic just makes my womb tingles.
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Re: Best/Favourite Kingdom (and Why?) Discussion

Unread postby lcklasman » Sat Jun 20, 2015 4:52 am

As many of you probably could tell, my favorite kingdom is Shu. I always found Liu Bei's rise to power as truly amazing, seeing as he started with only a small group of followers with no real power, into becoming one of the three major players during the Three Kingdoms period. Yes, he had a lot of help from Zhuge Liang and co. but the trials Shu had to go through were not easy, and they fought until the bitter end. Also Zilong is my personal favorite general. Even in real life history, his feat at Changban is pretty virtuous. I would not even think about putting my life in danger doing something not even assigned to me by my Lord. Yes, he did not actually fight anybody historically, but the thought would be very scary to me.
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Re: Best/Favourite Kingdom (and Why?) Discussion

Unread postby Sun Fin » Mon Jun 22, 2015 10:14 am

Elitemsh has argued fairly plausibly that Zhao Yun may have encountered some horseman squads on his way through but yeah I agree with your gist of it's one hell of a risk either way! In terms of no-one to someone your right Liu Bei did do a good job of that but so did Sun Jian/Ce across two generations!
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Re: Best/Favourite Kingdom (and Why?) Discussion

Unread postby LiuBeiwasGreat » Tue Jun 23, 2015 8:16 pm

Sun Fin wrote:Elitemsh has argued fairly plausibly that Zhao Yun may have encountered some horseman squads on his way through but yeah I agree with your gist of it's one hell of a risk either way! In terms of no-one to someone your right Liu Bei did do a good job of that but so did Sun Jian/Ce across two generations!


For a child of merchants Sun Jian did fantastic. He truly was one of the best officers of his time.
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Re: Best/Favourite Kingdom (and Why?) Discussion

Unread postby lcklasman » Wed Jun 24, 2015 11:32 pm

LiuBeiwasGreat wrote:
Sun Fin wrote:Elitemsh has argued fairly plausibly that Zhao Yun may have encountered some horseman squads on his way through but yeah I agree with your gist of it's one hell of a risk either way! In terms of no-one to someone your right Liu Bei did do a good job of that but so did Sun Jian/Ce across two generations!


For a child of merchants Sun Jian did fantastic. He truly was one of the best officers of his time.

Oh no, I am not disputing Jian/Ce's amazing job reconquering the last east of the Yangtze. However I consider Jian/Ce as pre-Wu while Quan/Liang/Xiu/Hao are the actual leaders. As the land was already claimed by his brother, Quan simply had to simply announce his title as emperor, while Liu Bei actually lived to take the Shu's land himself.
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Re: Best/Favourite Kingdom (and Why?) Discussion

Unread postby Sun Fin » Thu Jun 25, 2015 8:58 am

You make a fair point about Sun Jian, other than social ladder climbing and the creation of a core group of officers he didn't contribute that much to the birth of Wu. I don't think you can disconnect Wu from Sun Ce though, that's like saying that Cao Cao gets none of the credit for creating Wei because Cao Pi was the one who announced himself Emperor.
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Re: Best/Favourite Kingdom (and Why?) Discussion

Unread postby lcklasman » Thu Jun 25, 2015 9:52 pm

Sun Fin wrote:You make a fair point about Sun Jian, other than social ladder climbing and the creation of a core group of officers he didn't contribute that much to the birth of Wu. I don't think you can disconnect Wu from Sun Ce though, that's like saying that Cao Cao gets none of the credit for creating Wei because Cao Pi was the one who announced himself Emperor.

Well I see Cao Cao as more a part of wei because like Sima Yi, they already had practically all control. Sun Ce however was not truly in the position to declare himself as such, and Quan would be able to after the Battle of Chi Bi which Liu Bei also happened to take part in. Quan still had a job to do after his brother died. But it was simply expansion, while Bei had to actually establish land for himself.
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Re: Best/Favourite Kingdom (and Why?) Discussion

Unread postby Luis Cellung » Tue Jul 21, 2015 10:10 pm

I think you cant discredit sun ce as the one that lay down the foundation of eastern wu. Sun quan was in same position with cao pi. Sun ce already conquered yang province when he was assassinated, and as far as i know yang prov was the core of eastern wu. Sunce also the one that appointed he qi and give him order to subdue the shanyue tribe which the latter do succesfully

When han empire crumbling and both his rival claim the mandate of heaven, sun quan choice was bow down to either cao or liu or he stand equally with them. It has little to do with his victory in chibi other than maintain his power coz it didnt give him any political power. So i guess sun ce and latter sun quan before battle of chibi didnt declared themself emperor simply because yuan shu already do it.......and we all know what happen to him :wink:
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