Guan Yu, Zhang Liao and Xu Huang

Join the Romance of the Three Kingdoms discussion with our resident Scholars. Topics relating to the novel and history are both welcome. Don't forget to check the Forum Rules before posting.
Kongming’s Archives: Romance of the Three Kingdoms
Three Kingdoms Officer Biographies
Three Kingdoms Officer Encyclopedia
Scholars of Shen Zhou Search Tool

Guan Yu, Zhang Liao and Xu Huang

Unread postby Lord Zhang Liao » Sat Oct 25, 2003 12:26 am

How would being on opposing sides have affected the frendship of the two Wei officers and Guan Yu? Did it?
"A real man should die in front of the ranks, not hide behind a wall!"
User avatar
Lord Zhang Liao
Posts: 10
Joined: Fri Oct 24, 2003 11:45 pm
Location: Ru Yang

Unread postby bon bon » Sat Oct 25, 2003 5:56 am

In Confucius thought, loyalty towards your master ("zhong") takes precedence over loyalty towards your parents ("xiao"), and your friends ("yi"). The three listed here were all virtuous men, therefore their friendship would not affect them at times of war. On the contrary, Zhang Liao actually used his friendship with Guan Yu to Cao Cao's advantage. If Guan Yu rejected Zhang Liao's offer, I am sure Zhang Liao would leave Guan Yu to die on that mountain. Also when Xu Shu was tricked to go to Cao Cao, he was scolded by his mother because he betrayed his master Liu Bei. He tried to preserve his "xiao", but lost his more important "zhong" on the way. This is the path to wickedness, and his mother committed suicide because of his shame. In the end he lost both "zhong" and "xiao", and ended up a broken man.
bon bon
Posts: 14
Joined: Thu Jul 31, 2003 5:04 am

Unread postby Antiochus » Sun Oct 26, 2003 9:15 pm

I dont belive that Zhang Liao and Xu Huang had friendship with Guan Yu, but they had respect. It is two very different thing, Friendship and respect. Zhang Liao was saved by Guan Yu so he let him go when he had to return to his sworn brothers. Xu Huang never got the chance to do something like it but he did had a lot of respect for him. But if they were in the same battlefield, they would fight to the death.
Last edited by Antiochus on Thu Nov 20, 2003 12:37 am, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
Scholar of Shen Zhou
Posts: 2573
Joined: Fri Mar 28, 2003 5:29 pm
Location: Sherbrooke

Unread postby Rurouni Kenshin » Sun Oct 26, 2003 9:21 pm

Zhang Liao did have some times where he didn't kill Guan Yu out of friendship, and out of orders too. Guan Yu was tempted to move to Wei side for the battle of Guan Du by Zhang Liao. Without Zhang Liao there to persuade him, would he have accepted and went to Wei? Xu Huang and Guan Yu had some friendship, but Xu Huang didn't let that get in the way at Fanzheng, or wherever they fought. All three were friends, though they tried not to let friendship get in the way of what they did. So in the end, I guess its yourself before friends.
A beautiful face can win popularity, but a beautiful hand can win respect.

~Which one do you prefer?~

"I've killed a helluva lotta people to get to this one. And now, I'm gonna Kill Bill"
User avatar
Rurouni Kenshin
Scholar of Shen Zhou
Posts: 988
Joined: Wed Aug 06, 2003 8:04 pm
Location: Searching for the Death List Five

Unread postby Ma Zhi Xuan » Sun Oct 26, 2003 9:23 pm

Concerning Guan Yu and Xu Huang, at the siege of Fan Castle Guan Yu and Xu Huang were going to battle outside the gate against each other. When they met they talked of old times when Xu Huang was with Guan Yu when Cao Cao captured him and their friendship.

The minute they end the talk Xu Huang shouts to his men, ''anyone who can take this man's head will be rewarded graciously''. Guan Yu quite taken a back this, replies, ''what did you say that for?'', ''I can't let my personal feelings intrude on the command I was given''.

This shows Xu Huang's honourable persona and great leadership, by not letting his personal emotions affect his mission.
User avatar
Ma Zhi Xuan
Scholar of Shen Zhou
Posts: 1079
Joined: Sun Apr 06, 2003 7:49 pm
Location: In the Symphony of Destruction. Clashing the cymbols.

Unread postby Separation Anxiety » Mon Oct 27, 2003 5:57 am

I think Zhang Liao and Guan Yu were indeed friends. Didnt the book say that Zhang Liao often visited Guan Yu when Guan was in Cao Caos service? As for Xu Huang and Guan Yu, im not sure if they were great friends but probably just on an amiable level. Xu Huang seemed to be more loyal to Cao so he would follow orders no matter the situation.
Separation Anxiety
Scholar of Shen Zhou
Posts: 3467
Joined: Fri Jun 13, 2003 9:40 pm
Location: The search party never came...

Unread postby AkA23 » Tue Nov 04, 2003 10:27 pm

I think in the book Guan Yu and Zhang Liao were from the same village I might be wrong haven't read the book in a long time
Posts: 13
Joined: Mon Oct 20, 2003 12:44 am

Unread postby Pang tong 2 » Wed Nov 12, 2003 1:50 am

indeed i also believe Gaun Yu and Zhang Liao were good friends but as for Xu Haung and Guan Yu im not completely sure.though they may have respected each other and were quaint with each others abilities im not sure,because they both given the time would have killed each other.yet again i tell you im not a very knowledgable boy,so im very sorry i dont have much to add. :cry:
wisedom is far more than what we take it for.
Pang tong 2
Posts: 4
Joined: Wed Nov 12, 2003 1:22 am
Location: far from the present but near to the past

Unread postby Guan Yan » Fri Apr 25, 2008 9:37 am

Does anyone have some more evidence of the Guan yu xu huang freindship besides the xu huang attacking guan yu at fan.
Yuan shu you dare declare yourself emporor I shall bring the justice of the Han upon your head.
Guan Yan
Scholar of Shen Zhou
Posts: 1859
Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2008 8:53 am
Location: Central coast

Unread postby Yuan Sho » Sun Apr 27, 2008 6:39 am

The way to view this kind of relationship here of Guan Yu, Zhang Liao, and Xu Huang is this:

1. Guan Yu was the loyal type but, at times, a bit too over confident (Like his fight against Cao Ren and the events afterwards). Guan Yu had high respect for those who knew him well.

2. When it came to Zhang Liao, both he and Guan Yu were on good terms with one another since neither likes to surrender to another ruler so easily and since both of them spoke on each other's behalf.

3. Finally, Xu Huang had much respect for Guan Yu, but he always remembered to put his state affairs/matters first before letting old friendship get in the way.

All together, Guan Yu, Zhang Liao, and Xu Huang had strong bonds with each other, but when it is time for friendship to be put aside, it is only honor on the field.

Hope this explains it. If not, I'll further explain it later on.
"I would rather betray the world than let the world betray me." Cao Cao, ruler of Wei Kingdom.
Yuan Sho
Posts: 74
Joined: Fri Apr 21, 2006 11:15 pm
Location: South Land of the U.S.A.


Return to Sanguo Yanyi Symposium

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests

Copyright © 2002–2008 Kongming’s Archives. All Rights Reserved