Three Kingdoms Questions (You Ask, We Answer)

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Re: Three Kingdoms Questions (You Ask, We Answer)

Unread postby Rezko_Kanashi » Fri Mar 20, 2020 7:50 pm

I recently ran into something I heard of for the first time.

Chen Dao of Shu.

I guess a popular theory is that he was omitted from the Romance of the Three Kingdoms novel, because his feats supposedly went to Zhao Yun, and that they were common in life. Does anyone have any ideas as to what Chen Dao accomplished that may have been credited to Zhao Yun?
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Re: Three Kingdoms Questions (You Ask, We Answer)

Unread postby Sun Fin » Fri Mar 20, 2020 8:02 pm

RDC only has that:

- He joined Liu Bei in the mid-190s, while Liu Bei was in Yu Province
- Noted for bravery and loyalty
- Became Area Commander of the Yangzi Gorges with rank of General under Liu Shan

We basically know nothing about him, which always makes me sad too.
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Re: Three Kingdoms Questions (You Ask, We Answer)

Unread postby Rezko_Kanashi » Fri Mar 20, 2020 8:08 pm

I wonder if he was involved in Changban, and Mount Dingjin. Seems like a timeframe he should've been apart of.
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Re: Three Kingdoms Questions (You Ask, We Answer)

Unread postby Sun Fin » Fri Mar 20, 2020 8:15 pm

I mean, he must have been involved in Changban in some form, the whole of Liu Bei's force were fleeing. The details of his service will likely always be a mystery though. On the other hand, the historians loss is a novelists dream. :lol:
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Re: Three Kingdoms Questions (You Ask, We Answer)

Unread postby greencactaur » Sat Mar 21, 2020 4:19 am

I once remember reading he served as a body guard for Liu bei as well in a similar way that Dian Wei and Xu Zhu guarded Cao Cao. I don't recall where i read that though :\
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Re: Three Kingdoms Questions (You Ask, We Answer)

Unread postby DaoLunOfShiji » Sat Mar 21, 2020 4:54 am

I'm not sure there the idea of him taking Zhao Yun's feats comes from, but the SGZ records that the two were similar in their valor an bravery, and held similar rank.

Chen Dao, styled Shu Zhi, is from RuNan. He followed the First Sovereign since YuZhou, his office usually right below Zhao Yun. They are both known for their loyalty and bravery. In the early year of JianXing [CE 223-227], he has the rank of commander of YuAn, General Who Conquers the West, and title of Duke.
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Re: Three Kingdoms Questions (You Ask, We Answer)

Unread postby Tarrot » Mon Mar 23, 2020 8:20 pm

Does anyone know when the Ba commandery was divided under Liu Yan/Liu Zhang? For my Administrator Ranaks thing, there's a clear divide of multiple Administrators of Ba, but I'm not sure when/how Ba was divided and what it was named (Badong?) to differentiate it.
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Re: Three Kingdoms Questions (You Ask, We Answer)

Unread postby Taishi Ci 2.0 » Mon Mar 23, 2020 10:20 pm

According to the Book of Jin's Geographical Records, Liu Zhang split off part of Ba commandary in 201 to form Baxi.
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Re: Three Kingdoms Questions (You Ask, We Answer)

Unread postby Tarrot » Mon Mar 23, 2020 11:35 pm

Was Badong separate before 201 or not? Because in one of the bios in Rafe's dictionary, it mentions in Zhao Min's biography (HYGZ, forget which source that is in Rafe's dictionary) that he was an Administrator of Ba and that at the end of the Han the Ba commandery was split into 3. A quick look through Rafe's dictionary shows Badong and Baxi only appearing after the 200s (and without seeing the Chinese I'd assume they're Ba East and Ba West). Unfortunately, this does not help my administrator issue completely, but it is a start, and I can parse out that Pang Xi was likely an Administrator of Baxi (may have to check the Chinese SGZ on this) rather than Ba.
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Re: Three Kingdoms Questions (You Ask, We Answer)

Unread postby Fornadan » Tue Mar 24, 2020 6:39 am

On the advice of Zhao Wei 趙韙, Western Ba was split off as Yonging commandery 永寧郡 in 195. Some places say 190, but looks like this is a mistake.

Yonging was renamed Baxi in 201, same year as Badong was split off from Ba.
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