HHS biography of He Jin (translation)

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HHS biography of He Jin (translation)

Unread postby plunged » Mon Jan 02, 2017 11:33 am

Hello all (and Happy New Year!),

For some time I've had (lots of) help in translating the History of the Later Han biography of He Jin. Now that it's (as good as) finished, I'd like to share it and ask you what you think of it (by clicking on the picture).

Image(or here if the pic doesn't work)

(btw the original Chinese HHS biography of He Jin is here).

You may notice that some sentences are very similar to Rafe's in his Emperor Huan and Emperor Ling book. After the project was finished I compared it with his work and sometimes replaced sentences of ours with his (cause his English is much better obviously, and because I like his translations of terminology such as ranks and titles)

Since SGZ translations are getting more abundand, and HHS translations aren't, I may do some more of these in the future.

btw, if any of you spot any errors or suggest a better wording, please let me know!
Last edited by plunged on Sat Feb 18, 2017 5:43 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: HHS biography of He Jin (translation)

Unread postby Dong Zhou » Tue Jan 03, 2017 10:26 pm

Thank you for this

Interesting the conclusion and HHS comment, one positive, one negative. For me, I thought He Jin was an able politician, he was able to outmanoeuvre his foes, he acted as a focal point for the gentry faction, used talent. He lacked confidence/ruthlessness to destroy the eunuchs and had he won, I think he only slows the Han decline.

I have always liked the awe of eunuchs line
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Re: HHS biography of He Jin (translation)

Unread postby Zyzyfer » Wed Jan 04, 2017 12:41 am

I opened the link to the translation in a new tab, couldn't click the image.
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Re: HHS biography of He Jin (translation)

Unread postby Xu Yuan » Wed Jan 04, 2017 1:18 am

That was a fantastic read, thank you Plunged. It really portrayed He Jin in a different light and attributes his failure to bad luck (the Han being beyond help) rather than lack of intelligence. That said the massive delays, especially when Yuan Shao was so blatant in his desire to have the eunuchs killed, were a massive misstep and the end of the biography shows the consequences of the actions taken. What was really cool was Lu Zhi taking a front and center role in preventing the eunuchs from abducting the Empress and then set out after them. Of additional note is Guo Sheng being an ally of He Jin rather than the novelish "Ten Regular Attendants". That was rather surprising and these lines of friendships really does show why He Jin was so hesitant to act. Finally, it is always heart-warming to read when a famous figure is noted as being kind to their soldiers as it portrays a sense of empathy with the common man, which allows a person to empathize with their personage.
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Re: HHS biography of He Jin (translation)

Unread postby Sun Fin » Thu Jan 05, 2017 12:16 pm

Wow plunged! This is awesome!

Just got a few questions about it if you don't mind?

In the first year of Zhongping[n 2] the Yellow Turban Rebellion broke out and He Jin was named General-in-Chief (dà jiàngjūn 大將軍). He took command of the guards of the divisions of the Right and of the Left and of the Feathered Forest troops, together with the five regiments [of the Northern Army] and led them to camp at the Capital Hostel.

Ma Yuanyi 馬元義, assistant to Yellow Turban leader Zhang Jue 張角, planned and conspired for an uprising in Luoyang [, the capital city]. He Jin discovered the plot and was made Marquis of Shen.[1]


Where and what is the ‘Capital Hostel’? Did He Jin stay in command of those troops after he discovered the plot and was made Marquis? If so did they see any action?

Thanks buddy!
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Re: HHS biography of He Jin (translation)

Unread postby plunged » Thu Jan 05, 2017 1:31 pm

Thanks for the positive feedback everyone! Was a bit worried when I still hadn't received a reply here one day later :)

Dong Zhou wrote:Thank you for this

Interesting the conclusion and HHS comment, one positive, one negative. For me, I thought He Jin was an able politician, he was able to outmanoeuvre his foes, he acted as a focal point for the gentry faction, used talent. He lacked confidence/ruthlessness to destroy the eunuchs and had he won, I think he only slows the Han decline.

I have always liked the awe of eunuchs line


To me too. Shame the man behind the comment (probably Fan Ye) never really explained why, aside from the standard, yet shallow, "he came from a butchers family, had a pretty sister" etc. I think the Han would've declined in a completely different manner had He Jin wiped out the eunuchs. Doubt Dong Zhuo would've gone against him, He Miao, and Yuan Shao.

I've liked the eunuch stuff as well. This whole era with them, the Turbans, the He clan, is one of my favourites.

Zyzyfer wrote:I opened the link to the translation in a new tab, couldn't click the image.

It works for me in Chrome 55. Does anyone else have this issue?

Sun Fin wrote:Wow plunged! This is awesome!

Just got a few questions about it if you don't mind?

In the first year of Zhongping[n 2] the Yellow Turban Rebellion broke out and He Jin was named General-in-Chief (dà jiàngjūn 大將軍). He took command of the guards of the divisions of the Right and of the Left and of the Feathered Forest troops, together with the five regiments [of the Northern Army] and led them to camp at the Capital Hostel.

Ma Yuanyi 馬元義, assistant to Yellow Turban leader Zhang Jue 張角, planned and conspired for an uprising in Luoyang [, the capital city]. He Jin discovered the plot and was made Marquis of Shen.[1]


Where and what is the ‘Capital Hostel’? Did He Jin stay in command of those troops after he discovered the plot and was made Marquis? If so did they see any action?

Thanks buddy!


I should add a note in there about the Capital Hostel. Rafe, in Emperor Huan and Emperor Ling says this about the Capital Hostel:

It was evidently the most important of the thirty-two official hostels in the city and the suburbs. It served as an occasional lodging house for officials, and also for the emperor, but its regular function was as a police station for local law and order. From this and other occasions where we are told troops were assembled at the Capital Hostel, there must have been an open area by the hostel which could be used as a parade ground or assembly point for troops.


Later he also adds he suspects it lay near the Vermilion Bird Gate. This gate was used by Yuan Shao and He Miao to station their troops before they stormed the palace to massacre the eunuchs and avenge He Jin (emotional battle that must've been for Miao). Zhao Zhong was taken by Yuan Shao and He Miao about there.

It doesn't specifically say anywhere his command of those stopped, but since he was mainly a politician (General-in-Chief was a political title) he probably didn't keep them and were his just for the occasion

I think he had troops later on though, despite still being General-in-Chief. Jian Shi later tried to send him to attack the Liang rebels, and there was this scene with Emperor Ling and those platforms and in the end he handed over soldiers to He Jin.

After executing Jian Shi he also inherited Shi's troops (the Western Garden corps).
Last edited by plunged on Sat Jan 07, 2017 3:06 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Now with translations of: He Jin, Huangfu Song, Zhu Jun, Lu Zhi, Cheng Pu, Sima Shi, Lady Wang and many more.

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Re: HHS biography of He Jin (translation)

Unread postby Sun Fin » Thu Jan 05, 2017 1:51 pm

plunged wrote:
Zyzyfer wrote:I opened the link to the translation in a new tab, couldn't click the image.

It works for me in Chrome 55. Does anyone else have this issue?


Works perfectly for me!


plunged wrote: I should add a note in there about the Capital Hostel. Rafe, in Emperor Huan and Emperor Ling says this about the Capital Hostel:

It was evidently the most important of the thirty-two official hostels in the city and the suburbs. It served as an occasional lodging house for officials, and also for the emperor, but its regular function was as a police station for local law and order. From this and other occasions where we are told troops were assembled at the Capital Hostel, there must have been an open area by the hostel which could be used as a parade ground or assembly point for troops.


Later he also adds he suspects it lay near the Vermilion Bird Gate. This gate was used by Yuan Shao and He Miao to station their troops before they stormed the palace to massacre the eunuchs and avenge He Jin. Zhao Zhong was taken by Yuan Shao and He Miao about there.

It doesn't specifically say anywhere his command of those stopped, but since he was mainly a politician (General-in-Chief was a political title) he probably didn't keep them and were his just for the occasion

I think he had troops later on though, despite still being General-in-Chief. Jian Shi later tried to send him to attack the Liang rebels, and there was this scene with Emperor Ling and those platforms and in the end he handed over soldiers to He Jin.

After executing Jian Shi he also inherited Shi's troops (the Western Garden corps).


Thanks mate, the chronology of the YT is all over the place in my mind. Did He Jin discover the plot before Zhu Jun, Huangfu Song and Lu Zhi were sent out with armies?
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Re: HHS biography of He Jin (translation)

Unread postby Xu Yuan » Thu Jan 05, 2017 6:07 pm

Ah right, do we know what became of Guo Sheng? As He Jin's main information in the eunuch circle, was he also killed along with the rest of them? I know in the novel that's his fate (but in the novel he's just another faceless goon) but as he supported He Jin's agenda, was he spared?
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Re: HHS biography of He Jin (translation)

Unread postby DragonAtma » Thu Jan 05, 2017 6:29 pm

According to Gongjin's Campaign Memorials, the mains truggle between He Jin and the eunuchs was entirely in 189 -- and thus well after the turbans were defeated.

They don't say anything about when Guo Sheng died, but as both a eunuch and one of the regular attendants, it's very likely he was killed in the eunuch massacre, despite being He Jin's friend.
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Re: HHS biography of He Jin (translation)

Unread postby Sun Fin » Thu Jan 05, 2017 6:43 pm

DragonAtma wrote:According to Gongjin's Campaign Memorials, the mains truggle between He Jin and the eunuchs was entirely in 189 -- and thus well after the turbans were defeated.


Sorry I meant the YT plot for open rebellion in Luoyang!
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