New Three Kingdoms TV Series (2010) Discussion

Join the Romance of the Three Kingdoms discussion with our resident Scholars. Topics relating to the novel and history are both welcome. Don't forget to check the Forum Rules before posting.
Kongming’s Archives: Romance of the Three Kingdoms
Three Kingdoms Officer Biographies
Three Kingdoms Officer Encyclopedia
Scholars of Shen Zhou Search Tool

Re: New Three Kingdoms TV Series (2010) Discussion

Unread postby Nazne » Fri Sep 27, 2013 8:31 am

Cao Chao wrote:Never particularly been a fan of the new series, not to mention I believe that there is a downward trend for Chinese historical dramas in general. Higher production values does not equate with a better series. Honestly, Tang Guoqiang and Bao Guo'an both bring far more gravitas to their roles as Kongming and Mengde in the 1993 series compared to Chen Jianbin and Lu Yi in the 2010. Granted, the 1993 version had issues with actors coming and going, but I feel that the core characters were portrayed by seasoned, capable actors. This is not to say that the 2010 series doesn't have its moments, but the ridiculous miscasting of actors (though far far worse in the Red Cliffs film; I personally have always disliked Peter Ho as an actor, he's a 小白脸 and can't act) makes it quite meh ...


I'm going to argue the opposite; the '93 version actually set my RTK education back years, because the plot was so convoluted and determined to follow RoTK verbatim, and the one-time character appearances so often, that I generally couldn't understand what the majority of characters onscreen were doing and ended up tuning out the other two kingdoms and watching mainly for ZGL and Zhao Yun. The old series has its strong points in music (... barring some of the insert songs) and a more solemn sense of grandeur possibly inspired by its ever-present narrator; but in terms of characterization, plot, pacing, and approachability, I consider TK2010 superior.

As for core characters - I'd say the debate between RTK'93 and TK2010 has as much to do with the way 2010 reinterpreted certain characters' roles in the story, as it does with the actors' performances.

'93 Cao Cao was a serious, occasionally ruthless, "great man"-type character who expressed depths of emotion openly, and this fits Bao Guo'an's skills as a more traditional actor. However, he didn't leave much of an impression on me of what there was to admire or pay attention to about Cao Cao besides "greatness". In contrast, TK2010 Cao Cao is a massive troll who's devoted himself to power, is brilliant but paranoid, and who would rather die than admit or show weakness. I found Chen Jianbin's take on him both startling and refreshing, as it plays out Cao Cao's "guileful hero" epithet and makes for a more memorable character.

I'm a little more evenly split on the two versions' Zhuge Liang. '93 ZGL was effectively a god, effortlessly controlling plots and battles with a wave of his fan and a knowing smile, but basically shunting his lord(s) into the background as he did. To viewers, he seemed the personal representation of all of Shu's idealism and righteousness and the tragic hero who dies for a greater cause, and Tang Guoqiang played that character beautifully, especially as old!ZGL, when he could express his full range of authority and emotions. TK2010 Zhuge Liang, however, is less god and more mortal; he develops from arrogant young genius to loyal adviser to stubborn, weary minister, and he's not so much a hero of righteous ideals as he is someone who would die for the lord he considers worthy. A more authoritative and strong-willed Liu Bei means ZGL exerts less control over situations, is more able to show weakness, and inspires more empathy than deference. And while I don't think Lu Yi is an amazing actor, especially for older characters or positions of authority, I find his emotional acting, his illustration of ZGL's personality, and the interactions between his ZGL and Yu Hewei!Liu Bei very touching.

(Also, Tang Guoqiang gave me the impression that ZGL was like fifty when he left Longzhong. I watched the series first when I was six, and thought that was true for 14 years. <_<; )
先主復領益州牧,諸葛亮為股肱,法正為謀主,關羽、張飛、馬超為爪牙,許靖、麋竺、簡雍為賓友。
- 蜀书二 先主传
User avatar
Nazne
Master
 
Posts: 259
Joined: Sun Jul 31, 2011 10:31 pm

Re: New Three Kingdoms TV Series (2010) Discussion

Unread postby Ranbir » Fri Sep 27, 2013 5:35 pm

2010 have the better actors and manages to convey a much better drama. Some melodramatic moments but that's Asia for ya.


The old one is primarily a one man show.
"The imaginary number is a fine and wonderful resource of the human spirit, almost an amphibian between being and not being." - Gottfried Leibniz
Science snobbery.
User avatar
Ranbir
For Queen and Country
 
Posts: 8516
Joined: Mon Aug 18, 2003 9:27 am
Location: Your heart. <3

Re: New Three Kingdoms TV Series (2010) Discussion

Unread postby Lady Wu » Sat Sep 28, 2013 2:09 pm

Zorkaz wrote:I also think Guan Yu just looked way too small in the 2010 series, more like a garden gnome, when seen in comparision to Liu Bei and Zhang Fei.

Thanks. Now I'll never be able to look at a garden gnome with a straight face again.
"Whatever you do, don't fall off the bridge! It'll be a pain to try to get back up again." - Private, DW 8
User avatar
Lady Wu
There's no better state than Wu
There's no better state than Wu
 
Posts: 12847
Joined: Mon Aug 26, 2002 2:35 am
Location: Wu-ere else?

Re: New Three Kingdoms TV Series (2010) Discussion

Unread postby Cao Chao » Sat Sep 28, 2013 3:24 pm

Lady Wu wrote:
Zorkaz wrote:I also think Guan Yu just looked way too small in the 2010 series, more like a garden gnome, when seen in comparision to Liu Bei and Zhang Fei.

Thanks. Now I'll never be able to look at a garden gnome with a straight face again.

水浒传 has this same problem with Guan Sheng. At least Lu Shuming was 186 cm.
曹操曰:宁教我负天下人,休教天下人负我!
User avatar
Cao Chao
Langzhong
 
Posts: 590
Joined: Fri Oct 28, 2005 12:33 pm
Location: Whee?

Re: New Three Kingdoms TV Series (2010) Discussion

Unread postby capnnerefir » Sun Sep 29, 2013 1:39 am

Would anyone recommend that I watch this show?

The thing about me is that I much prefer the history of the Three Kingdoms to the fictional version. A lot of this is due to the fact that I just can't get behind anything that requires me to like Liu Bei and Company. But the Romance is an interesting story and I can enjoy it if the version I get is good to Cao Cao and the Sun family. I assume that this will be Liu Bei-centric and that history plays no role in this. It is, after all, an adaptation of a work of fiction. That's something I just have to accept if I'm going to watch it. I think I can deal with that if it's good to the other sides of the conflict.

So I guess my question is: How does this series portray Liu Bei's rivals? Knowing that I'm going to be on their side going into this, will I still be able to enjoy it or will it just frustrate me?
User avatar
capnnerefir
Scholar of Shen Zhou
 
Posts: 695
Joined: Tue Sep 18, 2012 8:41 pm

Re: New Three Kingdoms TV Series (2010) Discussion

Unread postby Starscream » Sun Sep 29, 2013 2:49 am

Imo, this series did justice to both the novel and history. The scriptwriters did their homework and interpreted characters and events with hints from SGZ at times. Most of the characters now have a chance to shine, and not just the 3 rulers, 5 tiger generals, Zhuge Liang and a few others.

You will get a satisfying bit of side story when the attention is shifted to Cao Cao and his sons. The storytelling is suspenseful (and chilling) and I can guarantee you that being Cao Cao's son is not exactly a privilege. At the other side of the river, the politics between Sun Quan, Zhang Zhao and Wu's military commander-in-chiefs is also full of complications and though it is a fictitious narration, I wonder if it is a very good hypothesis of their historical relationships sometimes.

My advice is to watch the series with an open mind and be prepared to throw away some of the traditional stereotypes that we are used to. The characters are still recognizable though, so it it like what I mentioned ages back, bringing the 2D SGYY into 3D.
”太慢了。“
User avatar
Starscream
Decepticon Air Commander
 
Posts: 2148
Joined: Mon Jun 17, 2002 5:36 am
Location: Lost in space

Re: New Three Kingdoms TV Series (2010) Discussion

Unread postby Ranbir » Sun Sep 29, 2013 5:16 pm

capnnerefir wrote:Would anyone recommend that I watch this show?

The thing about me is that I much prefer the history of the Three Kingdoms to the fictional version. A lot of this is due to the fact that I just can't get behind anything that requires me to like Liu Bei and Company. But the Romance is an interesting story and I can enjoy it if the version I get is good to Cao Cao and the Sun family. I assume that this will be Liu Bei-centric and that history plays no role in this. It is, after all, an adaptation of a work of fiction. That's something I just have to accept if I'm going to watch it. I think I can deal with that if it's good to the other sides of the conflict.

So I guess my question is: How does this series portray Liu Bei's rivals? Knowing that I'm going to be on their side going into this, will I still be able to enjoy it or will it just frustrate me?



It is a lot more balanced in terms of picking a side. You'll find it very good to Cao Cao and the Sun family. Infact, Cao Cao is one of the stars, Chen Jianbin's performance being a stellar one at that. This is not Liu Bei centric.
"The imaginary number is a fine and wonderful resource of the human spirit, almost an amphibian between being and not being." - Gottfried Leibniz
Science snobbery.
User avatar
Ranbir
For Queen and Country
 
Posts: 8516
Joined: Mon Aug 18, 2003 9:27 am
Location: Your heart. <3

Re: New Three Kingdoms TV Series (2010) Discussion

Unread postby Nazne » Tue Oct 01, 2013 5:10 am

capnnerefir wrote:Would anyone recommend that I watch this show?

The thing about me is that I much prefer the history of the Three Kingdoms to the fictional version. A lot of this is due to the fact that I just can't get behind anything that requires me to like Liu Bei and Company. But the Romance is an interesting story and I can enjoy it if the version I get is good to Cao Cao and the Sun family. I assume that this will be Liu Bei-centric and that history plays no role in this. It is, after all, an adaptation of a work of fiction. That's something I just have to accept if I'm going to watch it. I think I can deal with that if it's good to the other sides of the conflict.

So I guess my question is: How does this series portray Liu Bei's rivals? Knowing that I'm going to be on their side going into this, will I still be able to enjoy it or will it just frustrate me?


"Fairly" is the short answer. Cao Cao heads off the first five minutes of the first episode and is generally a joy to watch whenever he's onscreen, Sima Yi is actually quite unique as a character, and Sun Quan and Wu get a good number of well-characterized supporting characters who interact with each other more often than they do with Liu Bei and co. TK2010 doesn't rehash RoTK so much as it tries to walk back towards the historical version, and it's well-written enough that I enjoyed watching almost every faction's interactions (aside from anything involving Lu Bu and Diaochan).
先主復領益州牧,諸葛亮為股肱,法正為謀主,關羽、張飛、馬超為爪牙,許靖、麋竺、簡雍為賓友。
- 蜀书二 先主传
User avatar
Nazne
Master
 
Posts: 259
Joined: Sun Jul 31, 2011 10:31 pm

Re: New Three Kingdoms TV Series (2010) Discussion

Unread postby capnnerefir » Thu Oct 03, 2013 10:13 pm

Okay, it sounds like it's worth a watch, even for me. I'll give it a chance. Thanks everyone.
User avatar
capnnerefir
Scholar of Shen Zhou
 
Posts: 695
Joined: Tue Sep 18, 2012 8:41 pm

Re: New Three Kingdoms TV Series (2010) Discussion

Unread postby Lady Wu » Thu Oct 03, 2013 11:14 pm

capnnerefir wrote:Okay, it sounds like it's worth a watch, even for me. I'll give it a chance. Thanks everyone.

Don't go in expecting a documentary (this isn't). This is more of a show that tries to explore why people did the things that they did, what they would have felt, etc. Go in remembering that it's ok to take artistic liberties occasionally in order to paint a complete picture, and you'll enjoy the show. The Lu Bu/Diaochan bits at the beginning can feel a bit too much, but once you get through that the show really picks up. (Not to say the early section isn't good--Cao Cao is absolutely delightful in those first few episodes.)
"Whatever you do, don't fall off the bridge! It'll be a pain to try to get back up again." - Private, DW 8
User avatar
Lady Wu
There's no better state than Wu
There's no better state than Wu
 
Posts: 12847
Joined: Mon Aug 26, 2002 2:35 am
Location: Wu-ere else?

PreviousNext

Return to Sanguo Yanyi Symposium

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests

Copyright © 2002–2008 Kongming’s Archives. All Rights Reserved