Sun Ce Memorial Day

Join the Romance of the Three Kingdoms discussion with our resident Scholars. Topics relating to the novel and history are both welcome. Don't forget to check the Forum Rules before posting.
Kongming’s Archives: Romance of the Three Kingdoms
Three Kingdoms Officer Biographies
Three Kingdoms Officer Encyclopedia
Scholars of Shen Zhou Search Tool

Sun Ce Memorial Day

Unread postby Sun Gongli » Mon May 05, 2008 5:21 pm

Today (May 5, celebrated by many as Cinco de Mayo) is the 1808th anniversary of the death of Sun Ce. After a few years of unofficial observance, I hereby dub this day Sun Ce Memorial Day!

Even though his life was short and he had no outstanding political achievements like his longer-lived rivals and successors, it was his work that began to change southern China from the backward frontier region it was during the Han times to the eventual cultural and economic center of China for centuries to come. Sun Ce's pacification of Jiangdong paved the way for further economic developments by Sun Quan and, eventually, the Jin Dynasty. Sun Ce's influence also touched modern-day Vietnam, where he had established trade relations with the otherwise isolated Shi clan of Jiaozhou.

In addition, despite his often combative and hot-headed portrayal - which I blame on Dynasty Warriors - Sun Ce was a easy-going and benevolent ruler (though not without his faults, of course). He didn't allow his soldiers to pillage, and he didn't allow his officers to commit crimes. He recruited the able and the worthy regardless of background - take Lu Meng, who was a common soldier, or Zhou Tai, who was a pirate - and kept them in line. His administration did not suffer from the criminal elements that Sun Quan's did - Zhu Huan's violent tendencies, Gan Ning's wasteful ways, and Pan Zhang's greed, for instance. He listened to worthy men, even if he disagreed with them, whereas disagreeing with Sun Quan often resulted in alienation (Zhang Zhao, Yu Fan, Lu Xun).

In military affairs, Sun Ce was quite capable despite not having any formal training. His father died at an age before most of his contemporaries had finished their studies. His first military campaign was when others his age were holding cushy, low-ranked civil positions. He formed his own tactics and strategies, took the input of his officers, and fought battles alongside his soldiers. Some call this arrogance, but in Sun Ce's own words, how could he hope to be a leader of men if he didn't just share in their glories, but also in their hardships and dangers?

Sun Ce is one of the few figures whose death date has been so meticulously placed by historians. Regarded as a tragic hero by modern interpretation, Sun Ce fits the bill. Even if you favor Shu or Wei, at the very least, today should be a day where you reflect upon the short life of a man who did more in 25 years than most in the era did in 70. Not bad for a boy who lost his father at the age of 17 and rose his army from scratch, right?
"There are those who try to shape the world to their own whim,
and then there are those who allow the world to shape them.
It is in the balance that greatness is achieved."
User avatar
Sun Gongli
Poo Poo Pants
 
Posts: 4058
Joined: Thu Nov 04, 2004 2:56 am
Location: Spies destroy everything I create!

Unread postby Lady Wu » Mon May 05, 2008 7:22 pm

My poor son.

Ce, Mom loves you always!!
"Whatever you do, don't fall off the bridge! It'll be a pain to try to get back up again." - Private, DW 8
User avatar
Lady Wu
There's no better state than Wu
There's no better state than Wu
 
Posts: 12832
Joined: Mon Aug 26, 2002 2:35 am
Location: Wu-ere else?

Unread postby Mikhail » Mon May 05, 2008 7:36 pm

Did he really die on May 05?

Also, wasn't the Julian/Gregorian Calendar different from the Chinese calendar that they would have been using at the time?
Soweneul Malhaebwa (Tell me your wish).
User avatar
Mikhail
Great Sage Equaling Heaven
 
Posts: 2603
Joined: Thu Jun 23, 2005 11:15 am
Location: Toronto, Canada

Unread postby WuLordoftheNewAge » Mon May 05, 2008 8:26 pm

Well I think that it was converted... Maybe.

Either way I'll be remembering this for awhile.
Pang Tong: So I wonder what this place is called?
Sign by road: "Place where Pang Tong gets killed"
Pang Tong: Hmmm... I have a bad feeling about this place...

On Fallen Phoenix Slope.
User avatar
WuLordoftheNewAge
Langzhong
 
Posts: 566
Joined: Mon Feb 11, 2008 12:01 am
Location: location location.

Unread postby Sun Gongli » Tue May 06, 2008 12:32 am

Mikhail wrote:Did he really die on May 05?

Also, wasn't the Julian/Gregorian Calendar different from the Chinese calendar that they would have been using at the time?


May 5 has been widely adopted by Chinese and Western historians. The only alternate given, if you consider the changes, would be June 4. However, not a single website I've seen lists that as the date of death, and even Chinese websites have adopted May 5.
"There are those who try to shape the world to their own whim,
and then there are those who allow the world to shape them.
It is in the balance that greatness is achieved."
User avatar
Sun Gongli
Poo Poo Pants
 
Posts: 4058
Joined: Thu Nov 04, 2004 2:56 am
Location: Spies destroy everything I create!

Unread postby Phuc » Tue May 06, 2008 2:15 pm

Long live Sun Ce!

He's probably my favorite general/ruler of the Three Kingdoms.
My English isn't very good, so forgive me if there are any grammar/spelling mistakes in my posts.
Phuc
Student
 
Posts: 80
Joined: Wed Feb 06, 2008 3:30 pm
Location: Asia

Unread postby Mikhail » Tue May 06, 2008 3:15 pm

Well I like Sun Ce, a lot (he's not my favourite by any means) so I'll respect the day!
Soweneul Malhaebwa (Tell me your wish).
User avatar
Mikhail
Great Sage Equaling Heaven
 
Posts: 2603
Joined: Thu Jun 23, 2005 11:15 am
Location: Toronto, Canada

Unread postby Guan Yan » Thu May 08, 2008 6:48 am

Sun Ce is an awsome ruler he was a very smart ruler and general and a very good warrior, he was said to always be smling but that is in novel not sure about history.
Yuan shu you dare declare yourself emporor I shall bring the justice of the Han upon your head.
Guan Yan
Scholar of Shen Zhou
 
Posts: 1859
Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2008 8:53 am
Location: Central coast

Unread postby white_tiger_55 » Sat May 10, 2008 12:27 am

and what i know he was the only ruler what has had a duel with a feirce general alone and with no help against him
ala tasha ci
i am the one who they talk about
i am the one who they fear
i am the one who they need to see me for help
i am the one who wants me in there army
i am your enemys darkes nightmare
and you are?
white_tiger_55
Assistant
 
Posts: 118
Joined: Sat Nov 17, 2007 4:04 pm
Location: right next to your nearest store

Unread postby Guan Yan » Sat May 10, 2008 12:37 am

Yes Taishi was a feirce warrior and very strong, Sun Ce was praised for his skill, and was brave enough to put himself on the front lines without fear.
Yuan shu you dare declare yourself emporor I shall bring the justice of the Han upon your head.
Guan Yan
Scholar of Shen Zhou
 
Posts: 1859
Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2008 8:53 am
Location: Central coast

Next

Return to Sanguo Yanyi Symposium

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Majestic-12 [Bot] and 4 guests

Copyright © 2002–2008 Kongming’s Archives. All Rights Reserved