Cao Cao's Revenge Against Tao Qian

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Was it Tao Qian's fault that Zhang Kai murdered Cao Cao's family?

Yes
11
22%
No
38
78%
 
Total votes : 49

Cao Cao's Revenge Against Tao Qian

Unread postby Lord Chuff » Sun Jan 15, 2006 6:39 am

I want to know what you think about the Cao Cao, Tao Qian, Zhang Kai incident.

Was it Tao Qian's fault or not?

Personally I think he had no way of knowing that Zhang Kai would turn traitor, but if I was there, I wouldn't have trusted someone who used to be a Yellow Scarf.
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Unread postby Kong Wen » Sun Jan 15, 2006 7:11 am

Liu Pi and Zhou Cang turned out alright, not to mention Liao Hua and the scarves that Cao Cao incorporated into his army. I don't think it was Tao Qian's fault at all. Cao Cao wasn't the invincible warlord he would later become at the time, so Tao Qian probably just didn't think to send his family out with a more reliable escort (although he probably should have anyway). Still, I don't blame him.
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Unread postby brigadier liao hua » Sun Jan 15, 2006 11:54 am

I don't think Tao Qian was to blame. He put his trust in Zhang Kai which back fired, but that happened a lot in the Three Kingdoms Era, for example: Pan Jun with Guan Yu, Sima family with the Cao family, Meng Da with Liu Bei.

maybe he could have put someone more reliable in change like Zang Ba or Mi Zhu. But all that gold must have been very tempting, that could have even swayed these two.
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Unread postby Mikhail » Sun Jan 15, 2006 3:13 pm

Definately not.
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Re: Cao Cao's Revenge

Unread postby Beauty Warrior Zhou » Fri Jan 20, 2006 3:59 pm

Ma Chao, Spear of Justice wrote:I want to know what you think about the Cao Cao, Tao Qian, Zhang Kai incident.

Was it Tao Qian's fault or not?

Personally I think he had no way of knowing that Zhang Kai would turn traitor, but if I was there, I wouldn't have trusted someone who used to be a Yellow Scarf.


No, it wasn't. In addition Tao Qian tried to appologize to Cao Cao for his general's mistake, shown how sweet that old man was. :lol: However Cao refused to forgive him, then Tao Qian asked Liu Bei to help him.

But it is only in novel, historically it was definitely his fault and he wasn't that sweet.
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Unread postby Gal Jon » Fri Feb 03, 2006 9:42 pm

It just about somes up Cao Cao in my book, powerhungry but not willing to listen that often, unfortunatly the perfect general
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Unread postby jiang cheng » Wed Jul 05, 2006 2:45 am

I heard that old man was a miser and that he had 20 carts of stuff when he got moved out. Imagine that in the poor era, who would not be greedy.

But the most interesting thing is that Cao Cao was not really clpse to his father but he took his chance well on the old man's death and declare war and slain everyone and everything on his path.
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Unread postby Wo Long » Wed Jul 05, 2006 5:36 am

No, it wasn't his fault. You could place blame on him for choosing a poor escort service, but Kong Wen gave plenty of examples of Yellow Scarves who turned out just fine and even became incredibly loyal (Liao Hua - valiant warrior of Shu! :lol: ). Not to mention that he apologized to Cao Cao. An apology can hardly bring his father back from the dead, but it's not like Tao Qian did it on purpose. Zhang Kai is to blame, not Tao Qian.
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Unread postby Sun Gongli » Wed Jul 05, 2006 6:06 am

This particular incident is Zhang Kai's fault, not Tao Qian's. Of course, Tao Qian is hardly a saint, either. As a matter of fact, he's one of the most crooked men of the era.
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Unread postby Shadowlink » Wed Jul 05, 2006 1:31 pm

Sun Gongli wrote:This particular incident is Zhang Kai's fault, not Tao Qian's. Of course, Tao Qian is hardly a saint, either. As a matter of fact, he's one of the most crooked men of the era.
lol u dam right, tao qian should be more respoinsble for his generals.
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