Was it wrong of Sun Quan to execute Guan Yu?

Join the Romance of the Three Kingdoms discussion with our resident Scholars. Topics relating to the novel and history are both welcome. Don't forget to check the Forum Rules before posting.
Kongming’s Archives: Romance of the Three Kingdoms
Three Kingdoms Officer Biographies
Three Kingdoms Officer Encyclopedia
Scholars of Shen Zhou Search Tool

Was it wrong for Sun Quan to kill Guan Yu?

No, Sun Quan did the right thing.
42
56%
Yes, Sun Quan should not have killed Guan Yu.
31
41%
I managed to think of a third option... (Wow! Tell us!)
2
3%
 
Total votes : 75

Was it wrong of Sun Quan to execute Guan Yu?

Unread postby EmperorWei » Tue Mar 01, 2005 1:13 am

When Guan Yu was captured,Sun Quan gave him the offer of serving him, which was declined...of course. But in terms of good decisions and rightousness,did Sun Quan do a stupid thing, was such act unjust,
and how greatly would it benefit Wu in the future. Everyone knows,
that killing Guan Yu removes a major threat,but was his death too early
or untimely? :cry: :?
Last edited by EmperorWei on Tue Mar 01, 2005 7:32 am, edited 4 times in total.
"I do not fear an army of lions being led by a sheep,but do I fear an army of sheep led by a lion"-Alexander the Great
User avatar
EmperorWei
Master
 
Posts: 208
Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 4:33 am
Location: Canada,B.C.

Unread postby robbyjo » Tue Mar 01, 2005 1:17 am

What about a poll option of: "Sun Quan did it to gain competitive advantage against Shu."

-- Rob
User avatar
robbyjo
Überducky of Shen Zhou
 
Posts: 2767
Joined: Mon Feb 09, 2004 10:17 am
Location: Heaven

Unread postby Kong Wen » Tue Mar 01, 2005 1:20 am

I don't think Sun Quan made a stupid decision. He was at war with Shu. I can't count the number of times, while reading the book, that I read of people letting their enemies go for the sake of honour, only to have that decision come back to haunt them. Sun Quan actually had the brains to get rid of one of his biggest threats, and it eventually resulted in the deaths of Zhang Fei and Liu Bei as well (more big threats). I think it was a wise practical consideration.
"We spread the time as we can, but in the end the world takes it all back."
— Roland Deschain, Wolves of the Calla
User avatar
Kong Wen
The Bronze Age of SoSZ
The Bronze Age of SoSZ
 
Posts: 11832
Joined: Tue Jul 22, 2003 7:38 pm
Location: Canada

Unread postby EmperorWei » Tue Mar 01, 2005 1:20 am

robbyjo wrote:What about a poll option of: "Sun Quan did it to gain competitive advantage against Shu."

-- Rob


I dont think he did it for that reason,all he wanted was Jingzhou back..
"I do not fear an army of lions being led by a sheep,but do I fear an army of sheep led by a lion"-Alexander the Great
User avatar
EmperorWei
Master
 
Posts: 208
Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 4:33 am
Location: Canada,B.C.

Unread postby EmperorWei » Tue Mar 01, 2005 1:21 am

Kong Wen wrote:I don't think Sun Quan made a stupid decision. He was at war with Shu. I can't count the number of times, while reading the book, that I read of people letting their enemies go for the sake of honour, only to have that decision come back to haunt them. Sun Quan actually had the brains to get rid of one of his biggest threats, and it eventually resulted in the deaths of Zhang Fei and Liu Bei as well (more big threats). I think it was a wise practical consideration.


Bravo,quite a reasonable reply. :D
"I do not fear an army of lions being led by a sheep,but do I fear an army of sheep led by a lion"-Alexander the Great
User avatar
EmperorWei
Master
 
Posts: 208
Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 4:33 am
Location: Canada,B.C.

Unread postby Exar Kun » Tue Mar 01, 2005 1:30 am

Kong Wen wrote:I don't think Sun Quan made a stupid decision. He was at war with Shu. I can't count the number of times, while reading the book, that I read of people letting their enemies go for the sake of honour, only to have that decision come back to haunt them. Sun Quan actually had the brains to get rid of one of his biggest threats, and it eventually resulted in the deaths of Zhang Fei and Liu Bei as well (more big threats). I think it was a wise practical consideration.


Of course the long term effects of the entire affair are quite apparent also:
Complete destruction of the trust between and Wu,resulting in no cooperation over the next 40 odd years.
The result of which was of course no viable offensive threat against Wei.
"Two there should be; no more, no less.
One to embody the power, the other to crave it."
-Creed of the New Sith-
User avatar
Exar Kun
Dark Lord of the Sith
 
Posts: 3344
Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2003 12:18 am
Location: Cruising the Nether

Unread postby EmperorWei » Tue Mar 01, 2005 1:33 am

Exar Kun wrote:
Kong Wen wrote:I don't think Sun Quan made a stupid decision. He was at war with Shu. I can't count the number of times, while reading the book, that I read of people letting their enemies go for the sake of honour, only to have that decision come back to haunt them. Sun Quan actually had the brains to get rid of one of his biggest threats, and it eventually resulted in the deaths of Zhang Fei and Liu Bei as well (more big threats). I think it was a wise practical consideration.


Of course the long term effects of the entire affair are quite apparent also:
Complete destruction of the trust between and Wu,resulting in no cooperation over the next 40 odd years.
The result of which was of course no viable offensive threat against Wei.


What was Wei doing that time anyway,I'm not clear about that.
"I do not fear an army of lions being led by a sheep,but do I fear an army of sheep led by a lion"-Alexander the Great
User avatar
EmperorWei
Master
 
Posts: 208
Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 4:33 am
Location: Canada,B.C.

Unread postby Lady Wu » Tue Mar 01, 2005 1:33 am

Exar Kun wrote:Of course the long term effects of the entire affair are quite apparent also:
Complete destruction of the trust between and Wu,resulting in no cooperation over the next 40 odd years.
The result of which was of course no viable offensive threat against Wei.

Ignoring the question of whether Sun Quan was right to capture Guan Yu in the first place, what was he supposed to do with the captive if not execute him? Let him go bear a grudge and go home? So he can kill himself in shame and cause Liu Bei to fight Wu anyway? Or so that he can launch a revenge attack on Wu and get himself killed and cause Liu Bei to fight Wu?

PS: EmperorWei---Wei was getting its butt kicked by Guan Yu, and Cao Cao was even considering moving his capital city. One of the reasons Wu attacked Guan Yu was because they were afraid that the balance would be destroyed if Guan Yu manages to make a huge impact on Wei.
Last edited by Lady Wu on Tue Mar 01, 2005 1:36 am, edited 1 time in total.
"Whatever you do, don't fall off the bridge! It'll be a pain to try to get back up again." - Private, DW 8
User avatar
Lady Wu
There's no better state than Wu
There's no better state than Wu
 
Posts: 12836
Joined: Mon Aug 26, 2002 2:35 am
Location: Wu-ere else?

Unread postby EmperorWei » Tue Mar 01, 2005 1:35 am

Lady Wu wrote:
Exar Kun wrote:Of course the long term effects of the entire affair are quite apparent also:
Complete destruction of the trust between and Wu,resulting in no cooperation over the next 40 odd years.
The result of which was of course no viable offensive threat against Wei.

Ignoring the question of whether Sun Quan was right to capture Guan Yu in the first place, what was he supposed to do with the captive if not execute him? Let him go bear a grudge and go home? So he can kill himself in shame and cause Liu Bei to fight Wu anyway? Or so that he can launch a revenge attack on Wu and get himself killed and cause Liu Bei to fight Wu?


Wasn't Liu Bei a little reluctant at first to launch a invasion of Wu,
until Zhang Fei was assasinated? One more thing,if Guan Yu was not
so impatient about attempting to break out of Wu's barrier,would
he be captured anyway?
"I do not fear an army of lions being led by a sheep,but do I fear an army of sheep led by a lion"-Alexander the Great
User avatar
EmperorWei
Master
 
Posts: 208
Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 4:33 am
Location: Canada,B.C.

Unread postby Lady Wu » Tue Mar 01, 2005 1:47 am

EmperorWei wrote: Wasn't Liu Bei a little reluctant at first to launch a invasion of Wu,
until Zhang Fei was assasinated?

Zhang Fei was assassinated on the way to Wu. He did wait around until Cao Cao kicked the bucket and Cao Pi kicked Emperor Xian off the throne, before declaring himself emperor, and it is only after declaring himself emperor that he went to war with Wu. It was a calculated move rather than an impulsive, revenge-driven war, as we tend to view it. However, Guan Yu's death was a big catalyst in the matter.

One more thing,if Guan Yu was not
so impatient about attempting to break out of Wu's barrier,would
he be captured anyway?

Yes. Guan Yu was toast. The city was surrounded, his men had no heart for battle, and help was not arriving. Perhaps he could have snuck away if he had cut off his beard, dressed as a commoner, and had Guan Ping create a diversion in the opposite direction? :P
"Whatever you do, don't fall off the bridge! It'll be a pain to try to get back up again." - Private, DW 8
User avatar
Lady Wu
There's no better state than Wu
There's no better state than Wu
 
Posts: 12836
Joined: Mon Aug 26, 2002 2:35 am
Location: Wu-ere else?

Next

Return to Sanguo Yanyi Symposium

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot], Yahoo [Bot] and 3 guests

Copyright © 2002–2008 Kongming’s Archives. All Rights Reserved