Cao Cao...

Join the Romance of the Three Kingdoms discussion with our resident Scholars. Topics relating to the novel and history are both welcome. Don't forget to check the Forum Rules before posting.
Kongming’s Archives: Romance of the Three Kingdoms
Three Kingdoms Officer Biographies
Three Kingdoms Officer Encyclopedia
Scholars of Shen Zhou Search Tool

Unread postby Zhang Liao17 » Wed Aug 28, 2002 8:32 pm

Cao Cao is the greatest man to ever live. He was extremely successful as a troop leader and was among the best politicians of the time. He was a wonderful strategist and continued to demolish all opposing enemies until old age slowed him down. He was cunning and had a quick wit, nobody in the era was his equal. Cao Cao's cruelty only makes me like him more. I would have done everything he did, if I was in his shoes. He killed people like Dong Cheng only because they wanted to kill him. I don't see how anyone could like a pansy like Liu Bei, who cried whenever something went against him. Cao Cao was the greatest person of the era and he showed it time after time. Forget those passive losers like Liu Bei, Cao Cao was a real man.
"Death is but death, and why are you scared at it?"-Zhang Liao
User avatar
Zhang Liao17
Supreme Commander of Wei Forces
 
Posts: 930
Joined: Sun Jun 16, 2002 2:17 am
Location: Wei's Defender of He-Fei

Unread postby Mitsunari Ishida » Wed Aug 28, 2002 8:44 pm

He could also see a great hero, and was intelligent, and I definately think he was one of the best leaders of that time, maybe not the most generous, but who needs generous in war, he was one of the most professional leaders of that time. I like Sun Quan because he was both generous and professional.
Mitsunari Ishida
Scholar
 
Posts: 363
Joined: Sat Aug 17, 2002 9:21 pm
Location: England

Unread postby Zhou Gongjin » Wed Aug 28, 2002 8:53 pm

Zhang Liao17 wrote:Cao Cao is the greatest man to ever live. He was extremely successful as a troop leader and was among the best politicians of the time. He was a wonderful strategist and continued to demolish all opposing enemies until old age slowed him down. He was cunning and had a quick wit, nobody in the era was his equal. Cao Cao's cruelty only makes me like him more. I would have done everything he did, if I was in his shoes. He killed people like Dong Cheng only because they wanted to kill him. I don't see how anyone could like a pansy like Liu Bei, who cried whenever something went against him. Cao Cao was the greatest person of the era and he showed it time after time. Forget those passive losers like Liu Bei, Cao Cao was a real man.


A real man does not willingly slaughter innocent women and children. Dong Cheng's children and nephews had nothing to do with what he did but Cao Cao ordered them killed. He also had the consort of the Emperor, who was related to Dong Cheng strangled to death while she was pregnant!
Saying he was the greatest man who ever lived is utterly digusting and perverted. And a shame to all the good natured people who gave their lives to help others.
Bleh.
He who exercises government by means of his virtue may be compared to the north polar star, which keeps its place and all the stars turn towards it.
-孔夫子
User avatar
Zhou Gongjin
鋼のチビ
 
Posts: 3357
Joined: Fri Jun 14, 2002 3:49 pm
Location: the Doghouse

Unread postby Mitsunari Ishida » Wed Aug 28, 2002 8:58 pm

I think I remember that, Cao Cao did make some mistakes, but I still think he was one of the best leaders in the three kingdoms period.
Last edited by Mitsunari Ishida on Wed Aug 28, 2002 9:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Mitsunari Ishida
Scholar
 
Posts: 363
Joined: Sat Aug 17, 2002 9:21 pm
Location: England

Unread postby Zhang Liao17 » Wed Aug 28, 2002 8:59 pm

Zhou Gongjin wrote:
Zhang Liao17 wrote:Cao Cao is the greatest man to ever live. He was extremely successful as a troop leader and was among the best politicians of the time. He was a wonderful strategist and continued to demolish all opposing enemies until old age slowed him down. He was cunning and had a quick wit, nobody in the era was his equal. Cao Cao's cruelty only makes me like him more. I would have done everything he did, if I was in his shoes. He killed people like Dong Cheng only because they wanted to kill him. I don't see how anyone could like a pansy like Liu Bei, who cried whenever something went against him. Cao Cao was the greatest person of the era and he showed it time after time. Forget those passive losers like Liu Bei, Cao Cao was a real man.


A real man does not willingly slaughter innocent women and children. Dong Cheng's children and nephews had nothing to do with what he did but Cao Cao ordered them killed. He also had the consort of the Emperor, who was related to Dong Cheng strangled to death while she was pregnant!
Saying he was the greatest man who ever lived is utterly digusting and perverted. And a shame to all the good natured people who gave their lives to help others.
Bleh.


Slaughtering the whole family is the right thing to do. Only a moron would leave the kids to grow up and avenge their father and the mother to create more children that want revenge. Everything Cao Cao did is justified in my book and nothing is going to change that. Cao Cao was the most talented man of the era and his "cruelty" helped him survive longer than most people could hope to. His "cruelty" was what helped to establish his kingdom and without it, he would have been assassinated. Both Sun Quan and Liu Bei would have perished if they were in his shoes, they were too weak.
"Death is but death, and why are you scared at it?"-Zhang Liao
User avatar
Zhang Liao17
Supreme Commander of Wei Forces
 
Posts: 930
Joined: Sun Jun 16, 2002 2:17 am
Location: Wei's Defender of He-Fei

Unread postby Zhou Gongjin » Wed Aug 28, 2002 9:05 pm

*sigh*
I guess the end truly justifies the means.
I guess that justifies hitler killing 5 million jews
It justifies all the people who were killed by, or died by sickness of the atomic bombs on Japan
I guess that also justifies the ten thousand people that were killed when those planes crashed into the World Trade Centre doesn't it?

After all, war is just a game, human life has no value as long as your goals are met right?

Yes, those people are really justified and serve as role models for our future generations.
He who exercises government by means of his virtue may be compared to the north polar star, which keeps its place and all the stars turn towards it.
-孔夫子
User avatar
Zhou Gongjin
鋼のチビ
 
Posts: 3357
Joined: Fri Jun 14, 2002 3:49 pm
Location: the Doghouse

Unread postby Mitsunari Ishida » Wed Aug 28, 2002 9:15 pm

I do not think that Cao Cao is like Hitler, Hitler wanted to created a super race, where as Cao Cao wanted to rule China and he did it by wiping out family's, it was not nice but that is how a lot of people fought to get powerful 1,800 years ago, im not suprised, people back then thought in a completly different way. Cao Cao might have not done such violant and horrible things.
Last edited by Mitsunari Ishida on Wed Aug 28, 2002 10:10 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Mitsunari Ishida
Scholar
 
Posts: 363
Joined: Sat Aug 17, 2002 9:21 pm
Location: England

Unread postby Zhou Gongjin » Wed Aug 28, 2002 9:24 pm

Not all people thought that way. You should read the Confucian analects for starters.
Oh and to add to Cao Cao's magnificant track record: he killed the most prominent doctor of his era, Huo Tuo. But really, who would want someone like him going about curing people of things like thypoid? A guy like that really should die, of course, that is what a hero would do.
ZL17, one day, when you get an understanding what it is like to be a parent, or to want to be a parent, and at that day you will realize how very wrong it is what you just said.
I am sorry, I just can't help but feel really disappointed.
He who exercises government by means of his virtue may be compared to the north polar star, which keeps its place and all the stars turn towards it.
-孔夫子
User avatar
Zhou Gongjin
鋼のチビ
 
Posts: 3357
Joined: Fri Jun 14, 2002 3:49 pm
Location: the Doghouse

Unread postby Zhang Liao17 » Wed Aug 28, 2002 9:43 pm

Zhou Gongjin wrote:*sigh*
I guess the end truly justifies the means.
I guess that justifies hitler killing 5 million jews
It justifies all the people who were killed by, or died by sickness of the atomic bombs on Japan
I guess that also justifies the ten thousand people that were killed when those planes crashed into the World Trade Centre doesn't it?

After all, war is just a game, human life has no value as long as your goals are met right?

Yes, those people are really justified and serve as role models for our future generations.


This is a completely different situation and has nothing to do with the discussion. All those examples you gave are the exact opposite of the Dong Cheng situation. The Jews, Americans, etc., weren't any threat to the people they were killed by. Why is it someone always has to bring up a modern situation and try to use it. Its truly ridiculous that you would even dream to compare Cao Cao with Hitler.
"Death is but death, and why are you scared at it?"-Zhang Liao
User avatar
Zhang Liao17
Supreme Commander of Wei Forces
 
Posts: 930
Joined: Sun Jun 16, 2002 2:17 am
Location: Wei's Defender of He-Fei

Unread postby Zhang Liao17 » Wed Aug 28, 2002 9:48 pm

Zhou Gongjin wrote:ZL17, one day, when you get an understanding what it is like to be a parent, or to want to be a parent, and at that day you will realize how very wrong it is what you just said.
I am sorry, I just can't help but feel really disappointed.


Again this is totally irrelevant. I'm sure I've been at least as much of a parent as you have during your days. I have two nephews, I was there when they were born and I've helped to raise them with my sister over the years because her husband is an ass who doesn't want to take responsibility and raise them like he should. Again this has nothing to do with the discussion and is another modern example that can't be used to compare the situations. You look at everything from too much of a modern-christian point of view and it really clouds your sense of justice in the RTK era.
"Death is but death, and why are you scared at it?"-Zhang Liao
User avatar
Zhang Liao17
Supreme Commander of Wei Forces
 
Posts: 930
Joined: Sun Jun 16, 2002 2:17 am
Location: Wei's Defender of He-Fei

PreviousNext

Return to Sanguo Yanyi Symposium

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests

Copyright © 2002–2008 Kongming’s Archives. All Rights Reserved