Soccer teams?

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What soccer team do you support (if any)

Arsenal
16
13%
Manchester Utd
20
17%
Chelsea
8
7%
Liverpool
11
9%
AC Milllan
8
7%
Juventus
2
2%
Inter Millan
6
5%
Bayern Munich
4
3%
Other
44
37%
 
Total votes : 119

Re: Soccer teams?

Unread postby Sun Fin » Thu Jan 25, 2018 9:04 am

Last night went better than I feared! Not optimistic about our chances against City but I'm delighted to be in a final. Chelsea are becoming a team we enjoy playing in cups! :lol:

A few Spurs fans I've spoken to (I haven't watched enough of your games to speak with authority myself) have said that Davies is a fine replacement for Rose in a back line of 4 and can play effectively on the left of a central 3 but he doesn't carry the attacking threat to be an effective wing back. They are blaming your slightly worse form on the lack of width, something that has been somewhat mitigated by Son's awesome form. A name I've heard banded about by 2 fans that they'd like to sign is West Ham's Moussaka. What do you think?

Fair enough on Toby.
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Re: Soccer teams?

Unread postby Sun Fin » Thu Mar 01, 2018 9:19 pm

I agree with Wright, there is just no case for Wenger staying on next year. It's beyond embarrassing now. Surely the board have to recognise we need change. At this rate Wenger might be forced to step down before then...

Such a sad demise to a truly great servant to the club.
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Re: Soccer teams?

Unread postby Dong Zhou » Fri Mar 02, 2018 9:46 am

You mean hanging on against Swedish team who hadn't played a competitive game since November isn't the definition of success? It isn't like Spurs are ahead of us in... oh. Well it isn't like Spurs have turned up against big teams and got credible results in CL... oh.

There isn't the anger this year, not the mass protests and seething. Just weary acceptance, everyone but some of the board and Wenger knows Wenger has to go but it isn't going to happen. Wenger has lost the players (not in a "on strike way" but he can't inspire them), the fans, his big January shock to system hasn't worked. Even the media have come round fully that Wenger has to go, nobody is remotely trying the "entitled Arsenal fans, will miss him when he is gone, Wenger is overachieving" we got for years

The longer Wenger stays, the more damage he does to his club and to his legacy. He will be remembered fondly when he is gone but longer he stays, the more distance that may perhaps be needed
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Re: Soccer teams?

Unread postby Sun Fin » Fri Mar 02, 2018 10:45 am

When he was consistently achieving top 4 with minimal investment it wasn't a disaster, we weren't winning but I was content that we were remaining competitive. Then at some point a new manager could come in and would have a solid platform to launch from. That seems like a distant memory now.
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Re: Soccer teams?

Unread postby Dong Zhou » Fri Mar 02, 2018 1:13 pm

During the staduim repayment years, Wenger did very well and while there were issues that were not to do with money, he had earnt the right to have a go when we got cash to spend. He spent said cash, gave us a smallish lift but failed to fix issues which raised alarms among fans, board ignored the issues and we are now in a vicious circle of decline that leaves his successor a harder task then we once dreamed
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Re: Soccer teams?

Unread postby Sun Fin » Sun Mar 04, 2018 1:42 pm

I despair. I've run out of words at this point.
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Re: Soccer teams?

Unread postby Sun Fin » Fri Apr 20, 2018 10:01 am

:shock:

Wenger has announced that he is leaving at the end of the season! I'm in shock! Whilst it has seemed increasingly likely that it would happen soon with results deteriorating the actual moment feels surreal!

I was only 5 when he was appointed and I don't recall a time when he wasn't our manager. Along with Tony Blair as Prime Minister he was one of the great constants of my childhood. He is certainly one of the greatest managers we've ever had, his early impact and trophy haul was spectacular and the Invincible season is a feat which I'm still proud off today. Then in later days when success dried up Wenger did a great job of keeping us in the CL and competitive during the hard days of the stadium move. Since then his won a few FA Cups but its not been the level he and the fans expect; particularly in the last 2 years when we've been out of the Champions League.

It was certainly time for him to move on, however I'm still gutted that it had to happen. I'm glad its been handled with decorum, allowing him to see out his last season and have one last chance of winning silverware. He deserves the respect and love of all Arsenal fans and we owe him huge thanks for what he has achieved. the team better play their hearts out and the fans better get behind him for his grand finale!

The next big question of course is what next. Like Manchester United post Fergy I'm expecting a few tough seasons whilst we readjust but who will we get as manager? Former Dortmund manager Thomas Tuchel would be my first pick I think! Whats your reaction Dong?
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Re: Soccer teams?

Unread postby Dong Zhou » Sat Apr 21, 2018 3:43 pm

I believe PSG have already got Tuchel?

I think the sense was on the board was preparing for next summer but had started drawing up potential shortlists. Given Wenger has made a point of never resigning, one wonders how much pressure he was put under or if he sensed a loss of support among the board who must have been alarmed at the empty seats even if they had shown no reaction to our on pitch decline.

I came into football in the late 90's so for all my supporting life, Wenger has been Arsenal manager. He will rightly be remembered as arguably the great Arsenal manager and had, for me, two great era's. The trophy winning era where he changed UK football by exposing it's parochial unfit attitudes while giving England a thrilling football side, even going a season unbeaten. Then we had the staduim years, where he had a limited budget and had to try to keep his sides in the top 4, tended to build sides that just lacked a few things and where players left for their own (rightly) ambitions . Wenger made mistakes, he tried to make up for lack of money with a wage system that didn't pan out (fair play for trying though), and some of the issues that have cost him now ("what's a holding midfielder?", questionable choice of keepers, "what is rotation?") were emerging but for most part he did a very good job with limited funds. Due to him, we have some of the strongest finances in Europe and a top class ground, that will be his legacy.

Then the third era. We had the money now, now was the time to compete! Big money on players like Ozil, Sanchez and so on. End result? We would go up from 4th to dizzying heights of... 3rd and go from cup runs to winning Fa Cup but we were still miles behind even the mighty Leicester (a year that really cost Wenger support among fans) and Bayern complained to Uefa that their Cl ties with us couldn't count as a competitive game anymore. Pretty much all of Wenger's strengths were now matched by others which mean his weaknesses (not a taciticain for exposed) were more exposed while a man who once created systems that enhanced players has been arguably hindering players, figures like Oxlade have decided to leave club for sake of their development. Wenger more and more came to rely on "shock tactics" late in seasons to scramble up the table like changing to 3 at the back or major personal changes which should have warned board he was losing his touch.

Wenger has stayed on too long and has left the club in some relative difficulties. Two seasons out of CL will hit finances and pulling power, squad needs fixing (though I think the right manager can get more out of certain players) and is unbalanced, getting back in has proven difficult for plenty of other teams who thought "only a year". I blame the board more then I blame Wenger, they are his boss and they failed in their duty, hurting Arsenal and Arsene.

A change won't automatically change things, it is entirely possible we hire a Moyes/Hodgson like figure and go even further backwards, but we couldn't continue on. A good appointment could revitalise the club and perhaps a summer break then a fresh challenge may help Wenger find his old self again

Fingers crossed we go out on a high, Wenger winning a trophy in Europe would be ideal and hope fans will rally round him for the send off. Whatever has gone wrong, he cared for the club and has brought us many many great memories that will last longer then the bad
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Re: Soccer teams?

Unread postby Sun Fin » Sat Apr 21, 2018 4:40 pm

Finally! :wink:

Dong Zhou wrote:I believe PSG have already got Tuchel?


So a few people have said but I've only heard it second hand. As far as I'm aware an announcement hasn't come from PSG, Tuchel or a reputable news organisation. For example all I've seen from the BBC on the topic is they think its unlikely he'll come to Arsenal as he'd fallen out with Dortmund's former and our current head of recruitment.

I might well be proven wrong but from what I've read of Tuchel's career so far he seems like to like a challenge rather than procession. Therefore I think it's unlikely he'll go to PSG.

Dong Zhou wrote:I think the sense was on the board was preparing for next summer but had started drawing up potential shortlists. Given Wenger has made a point of never resigning, one wonders how much pressure he was put under or if he sensed a loss of support among the board who must have been alarmed at the empty seats even if they had shown no reaction to our on pitch decline.


Someone suggested that Wenger genuinely considered leaving last season but the infrastructure wasn't in place to find replacements for his various roles. Therefore he decided to stay on to allow these to be put in place, intending to give it two years but because of form he's reconsidered. I'm not 100% sold on the truth of that theory but I like it as it references shows Wenger's famed integrity.

Dong Zhou wrote:Wenger has stayed on too long and has left the club in some relative difficulties. Two seasons out of CL will hit finances and pulling power, squad needs fixing (though I think the right manager can get more out of certain players) and is unbalanced, getting back in has proven difficult for plenty of other teams who thought "only a year". I blame the board more then I blame Wenger, they are his boss and they failed in their duty, hurting Arsenal and Arsene.


David Dein was never properly replaced and he was the one man with more authority than Wenger.

Dong Zhou wrote:A change won't automatically change things, it is entirely possible we hire a Moyes/Hodgson like figure and go even further backwards, but we couldn't continue on. A good appointment could revitalise the club and perhaps a summer break then a fresh challenge may help Wenger find his old self again


I've been pleasantly surprised with the caliber of manager we've been linked with considering how low our stock has fallen in the last few years. For example Ancelotti has reportedly expressed interest in the role. Man U showed the potential risks of changing after a long period of time, but I also think our circumstances are different. Ferguson left after winning the Pemier League, this is Wenger's lowest ebb so expectations for the next manager should be more realistic. SAF also left behind an aging squad with Vidic and RVP, the stars of his team, in their last real season. In the likes of Ramsey, Ozil, Aubameyang and Mkhitaryan Wenger is leaving a strong core behind.

Dong Zhou wrote:Fingers crossed we go out on a high, Wenger winning a trophy in Europe would be ideal and hope fans will rally round him for the send off. Whatever has gone wrong, he cared for the club and has brought us many many great memories that will last longer then the bad


The fans better get behind him, it would be a disgrace if we didn't give him a proper send off. Times might have got hard in the last few years but his done so much for the club that he deserves our respect.

The BBC have done a best xi of Wenger's era, what players would you have Dong? I went for:

GK: Seaman
RB: Sagna
CB: Adams
CB: Campbell
LB: Cole
RM: Overmars
CM: Vieira
CM: Silva
LM: Pires
ST: Henry
ST: Bergkamp.

Honourable mentions to Lehman, Dixon, Ljungberg, Fabregas, Sanchez and RVP. All of these were great players who were very close to being in my team. I also thought about Bellerin but decided he hadn't fulfilled his potential under Wenger but I hope that we hang on to him as I think in years to come he'll be mentioned in the same breath as many of these players!

Apparently in the BBC poll Henry was only the 8th most popular player and not even the top forward, with Bergkamp ranked above him. Personally I expected him, Adams and Vieira to just be in 100% of teams! No offensive to Bergkamp, he is a great player and one of our best ever, I just didn't think he''d do better than the King of Highbury himself!
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Re: Soccer teams?

Unread postby Dong Zhou » Sun Apr 22, 2018 2:54 pm

Guardian and Eurologues podcast for Tuchel as has BBC's David Orsient here Arsenal have been linked to the former Borussia Dortmund coach Thomas Tuchel, who has admirers at the club. But any move might have been complicated by the fact he fell out with Mislintat when they were together in Germany. That will likely be irrelevant, though, as it is my understanding he is going to take charge of Paris St-Germain.

Press have seemed certain and been wrong before so Arsenal could make enquires but I would put him on unlikely list for now

Someone suggested that Wenger genuinely considered leaving last season but the infrastructure wasn't in place to find replacements for his various roles. Therefore he decided to stay on to allow these to be put in place, intending to give it two years but because of form he's reconsidered. I'm not 100% sold on the truth of that theory but I like it as it references shows Wenger's famed integrity.


It is possible though I still think he would have fancied himself to turn it around next year and something may have pushed him

David Dein was never properly replaced and he was the one man with more authority than Wenger.


Agreed. I mean Dein became a bit "and would be the answer to all our problems, he would also solve world hunger if he was brought back" in some years but he was never replaced with a figure to counterbalance Wenger. Gazadis has shown some signs of it but he has struggled to get support of the board

I've been pleasantly surprised with the caliber of manager we've been linked with considering how low our stock has fallen in the last few years. For example Ancelotti has reportedly expressed interest in the role. Man U showed the potential risks of changing after a long period of time, but I also think our circumstances are different. Ferguson left after winning the Pemier League, this is Wenger's lowest ebb so expectations for the next manager should be more realistic. SAF also left behind an aging squad with Vidic and RVP, the stars of his team, in their last real season. In the likes of Ramsey, Ozil, Aubameyang and Mkhitaryan Wenger is leaving a strong core behind.


True. I think more can be got out of the likes of Xhaka and Mustafi as well whereas Ferguson got the best out of his ageing side. Man U were also unfortunate (bar Moyes was an awful pick) in that Moyes first big job and first time Ed Woodword was handling transfers, we might have issues with a truncated summer+new transfer team but at least they have expirence at other clubs.

My one change on your list was Lauren at rightback
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