Books on Chinese literature, history, and strategy.

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Unread postby yoshitsune » Mon Oct 30, 2006 8:52 am

Mechromancer wrote:Does anyone know of any good novels based upon the spring and autumn period? Like a novel doing for that period what ROTK did for the three-kingdoms period. I'm looking for a novel ABOUT the period, as in warfare, tactics, cunning, etc., not a novel which simply happens to TAKE PLACE in the period, but is about something else really. Recomendations for novels like ROTK would also be appreciated. Thanks.


Hey, here are some of the novels about the period that I recommend you have a read. I'll put the Chinese characters in as well:

1.) dong zhou lie guo zhuan 东周列国转 - probably the closets for SGYY (ROTK) you'll find for that period.

2.) shi ji 史记- this is not just an item that boost intelligence in RTOK games, it's written in early Han by simaqian, and deemed the most famous historical piece in chinese history.

3.) lu shi chun qiu 吕氏春秋 - a novelised version of history written by a prominent figure in the period.

Don't know if any of them is translated into English, so if anyone knows about this, please post.
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Unread postby Mechromancer » Tue Oct 31, 2006 6:27 am

Thanks yoshitsune-dono,

I think I found #3 in English--I couldn't find the other two:

http://www.amazon.com/Annals-Lu-Buwei-Complete-Translation/dp/0804733546/sr=8-2/qid=1162275208/ref=sr_1_2/002-8447540-8395269?ie=UTF8&s=books

Is it really a novel about the wars, warriors, generals, heroes, and leaders of the era? It sounds more like an ancient encylopedia or work of chinese-philosophy than a novel, from Amazon.com's descript at least.
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Unread postby Zhai Rong » Wed Nov 01, 2006 8:41 am

Various translations of #2 exist. I own the Qin volume of Records of the Grand Historian translated by Burton Watson, which covers various Qin people from mystical times through to pretty much the end of the Qin dynasty (including Lü Buwei, author of #3). He also references a 1969 translation by the himself, and some footnotes indicate that it contains biographies not contained within the Qin volume. Another book referenced you can see described here, which apparently has translations of several non-Qin people. I don't know if the latter two overlap, because I have read neither.

On #3, I'd suspect that it's more of an encyclopedic work, since Lü Buwei is mentioned in #2 as having offered money to "anyone who could add or subtract a single character from it." Not the sort of thing you'd offer for a novel.
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Unread postby Mechromancer » Mon Nov 06, 2006 3:13 am

Does anyone know who wrote #1? Maybe that would help in finding a translation. I'm searching for stuff like "Fall of Eastern Zhou Dynasty" but it's not turning up anything.
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Unread postby yoshitsune » Tue Nov 07, 2006 1:22 am

Mechromancer wrote:Does anyone know who wrote #1? Maybe that would help in finding a translation. I'm searching for stuff like "Fall of Eastern Zhou Dynasty" but it's not turning up anything.


Sorry had a search for it, but doesn't give anything. Don't know if this is translated or not, but I'll let you know once I find it.
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Unread postby Lady Wu » Sun Nov 26, 2006 8:57 am

I'm not aware of a translation of the DZLLZ (Eastern Zhou blahblahblah), but IMHO it's nowhere near RoTK. Just like RoTK, DZLLZ tries to present a coherent, chronological story of the states of the Eastern Zhou, based on historical records like the Records of the Grand Historian (btw, I believe Watson's is the only full translation published). However, due to the nature of the stories, it reads just like a string of little story after little story, with little connection between them.

I still think the Grand Historian is a better read.
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Unread postby Mistelten » Thu Jan 25, 2007 5:52 am

I'm looking to read a detailed book on the post 3K/Age of Division. Anything that goes into the details of the wars for the capital at the end of the 3rd century. In particular, Liu Yuan, the Xiongnu chief who declared himself "King of Han." I had read once somewhere that Cao Cao's teachings were carried down for centuries after his death. Is there anything that goes into more detail about this?
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Unread postby cao cao#1 » Fri Mar 16, 2007 1:46 pm

where might I purchase the following books

Sanguo Zhi ( annals of the three kingdoms)

The generall history for the aid of goverment by Sima Guang if this has even been translated.

Generals of the South: The Foundation and Early History of the Three Kingdoms State of Wu (Faculty of Asian Studies Monographs) (Paperback)
by Rafe de Crespigny

The complete Grand Scribe's Records should be something like 8 volumes

And what was that book that Cao Cao wrote?
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Unread postby Jiang Yi » Sat Sep 08, 2007 6:21 am

i recommand water margin, three kingdoms, journey to the west, and romance of the Sui-Tong dynasties
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Unread postby Tianshan Zi » Sun Sep 09, 2007 6:24 am

Mistelten wrote:I'm looking to read a detailed book on the post 3K/Age of Division. Anything that goes into the details of the wars for the capital at the end of the 3rd century. In particular, Liu Yuan, the Xiongnu chief who declared himself "King of Han."
According to the not-so-detailed Osprey book by Chris Peers covering the period, Liu Yuan was a desendant of an imperial Han princess married into the Xiongnu to buy peace, he declared himself to be the heir to the Han, and his son sacked the Jin capital in 311. Changan fell in 316.
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