Lu Xun/Lu Kang relay

Questions, feedback, suggestions, and Kongming's Archives projects.

Unread postby Lady Wu » Sat Jun 21, 2003 7:21 am

Here we go for Lu Xun (drat that guy, why is he writing so many memorials?? :x):

Sun Quan wanted to send a force to take over Yizhou and Zhuya, and consulted Lu Xun on the matter. Lu Xun wrote to him, saying, "I, your humble servant, think that since the land within our boarders is still not completely peaceful yet, we should gather the strength of the people to address current concerns. For many years now we have been engaged in warfare, and our forces have decreased; furthermore, Your Majesty has been so worried with the matter that sleep and meals have been neglected in order to plan the expedition against Yizhou. After considering it several times over, I still do not see the benefit of this action.

Sending our forces over such a great distance, we can predict neither wind nor waves; Being in a foreign land, our men would definitely become ill. If we are to dispatch our men to such wild lands, we would lose when we wish to gain, and potential benefits would turn to harm. Furthermore, Zhuya is a dangerous land, and its inhabitants are like wild beasts. Even if we were to take over their people, they would be of no use to us; and if we don't keep a military presence there we could not control them either.

We have enough men and resources within Jiangdong to fulfill the Great Ambition, and all we need to do is to conserve our strength and then proceed in action. When Prince Huan [Sun Ce] established his power, he started off with not even a full company of soldiers, but eventually he built a successful rule. Your Majesty has continued to follow the Mandate and built up the kingdom by the River -- now I've heard that while the awe inspired by an army is required to subdue trouble-makers and rebels, the most basic industry of the people should be farming for food and producing silk in order to feed and clothe themselves. However, now fighting has not ceased yet, but the people are hungry and cold. My humble view is that we should let the people rest and be nourished, and relax rents and taxes, so that we achieve harmony and encourage bravery through righteousness. In that way the lands of the Yellow River and Wei River will become ours, and unity will be brought to all under heaven."

However, Sun Quan went ahead and attacked Yizhou. And indeed, the gains from that action could not make up for the losses.
"Whatever you do, don't fall off the bridge! It'll be a pain to try to get back up again." - Private, DW 8
User avatar
Lady Wu
There's no better state than Wu
There's no better state than Wu
 
Posts: 12840
Joined: Mon Aug 26, 2002 2:35 am
Location: Wu-ere else?

Unread postby Starscream » Sun Jun 22, 2003 5:12 am

Continuing Lu Xun biography....thanks Lady Wu for helping me clear one of his many memorials! :P

When Gongsun Yuan betrayed the alliance with Wu, Sun Quan contemplated to lead an expedition against him. Lu Xun petitioned, "Gongsun Yuan relied on the geographical advantage of his land and the strength of his defences to detain our country's messager and refused to pay the tribute of fine horses, such actions indeed fuel our hate and anger. The Manyi (barbarians) disturb the peace in the Central Plains because they have yet to receive the teachings of the saints and kings of our lands. They are like birds flocking together in a wilderness far away, resisting against our country's army and made Your Majesty so upset, such that you would even board a light vessel to sail across the vast seas to attack them, without considering the dangers and unpredictability of this venture. At present, the world is in turmoil and many lords are fighting one another like fierce tigers, many talented individuals restless and battlecries rang as they glared at one another with enmity. By Your Majesty's divine and commanding splendour, you have followed the Will of Heaven to crush Cao Cao at Wu Lin, defeated Liu Bei at Xi Ling, and captured Guan Yu at Jing Zhou. All these three men are the heroes and talents of this era, but you have thwarted them one by one. Within ten thousand li, the commoners received reassurance from Your Majesty's guidance like the wind caressing the grass. Now is the time to bring peace and unity to the Central Plains. If Your Majesty is unable to put up with such small grudges and lose your temper, you would be going against the warnings of the old of not sitting under the edge of the roof to prevent getting hit by chipped tiles. Why Your Majesty is able to underestimate your own high prestige is what your servant cannot understand at all. I have heard of a saying that a person who is determined to walk ten thousand li is not willing to stop halfway and likewise, a person who has designs to conquer the world will not allow a small incident to disrupt the grand plan. The strong enemies are at our borders but in contrast, the far regions do not belong to the imperial courts (* probably referring to Han dominions in general). Should Your Majesty board the ships to go on a far expedition, you will be giving the enemies a chance to attack us. By the time you worry of the arriving dangers, it will be too late to regret. If we can successfully unite the world, Gongsun Yuan will surrender to us without having to conquer him. If Your Majesty cannot part with the horses and people of Liao Dong, then can you possibly part with the grand establishments in Jiang Dong? Your humble servant begs you to cease all preparations for the expedition in order to defend against the main enemies. We should pacify the Central Plains as soon as possible and bring glory for the descendants to remember." Sun Quan thus accepted his proposal.
”太慢了。“
User avatar
Starscream
Decepticon Air Commander
 
Posts: 2146
Joined: Mon Jun 17, 2002 5:36 am
Location: Lost in space

Unread postby Starscream » Wed Jun 25, 2003 8:08 am

Continuing Lu Xun biography....with CK's help! :lol:

In the fifth year of Jia He (A.D. 236), Sun Quan led a northern expedition to Wei, sending Lu Xun and Zhuge Jin to attack Xiang Yang. Lu Xun dispatched his trusted subordinate, Han Bian, to bring a report to Sun Quan, but on the way back, Han Bian encountered enemy soldiers at Mian Zhong. He was discovered by the enemies after a pillage and search. When Zhuge Jin got news of this, he was extremely terrified and wrote a letter to Lu Xun, " His Majesty has just retreated and the enemies have captured Han Bian, thus they have gained our crucial military information. Moreover, the rivers have dried up, hence we should make a hasty withdrawal as well." Lu Xun did not reply this letter, instead he supervised the civilians to plant turnips and beans, played chess and guessed riddle games with his subordinates just like usual. Zhuge Jin commented, " Lu Boyan is an ingenious person, he has a plan surely", thus he personally visited Lu Xun. Lu Xun said, "Our adversaries knew that His Majesty had retreated so they have no worries and can concentrate their forces against us. Moreover, they have already positioned their armies at strategic points. Our troops' morale is wavering, so we should keep ourselves composed in order to calm the fears of our troops. Following that, we can put into good use flexible strategies first before making a retreat. If we give any hints of withdrawal now, the enemies will think that we are afraid and continue to pursue our troops, which will undoubtedly lead to our defeat."

Consequently, Lu Xun and Zhuge Jin secretly discussed and agreed on the strategems; Zhuge Jin was to lead the boats while Lu Xun commanded all the overland troops; before they proceeded to attack Xiang Yang city. The enemies were always fearful of Lu Xun and they immediately headed back into the city. Zhuge Jin thus led the navy to set off, whilst Lu Xun slowly reorganised the army, put on a false show of might, and proceeded on foot to board the ships. However, the enemies dared not confront him. When the army reached Bai Wei, Lu Xun announced to settle down at the region to hunt, while secretly ordering General Zhou Jun, Zhang Liang and others to invade Xin Shi, An Lu and Shi Yang counties of the Jiang Xia commandery. At that juncture, Shi Yang county was bustling with activities and when Zhou Jun arrived suddenly, the people threw down their possessions hastily and ran back into the city, resulting in a blockage at the city gates which prevented them from being closed. The enemies had to kill their own civilians in order to shut the city gates. The Wu army slaughtered and captured some one thousand peasants (1). Among those captured alive, they were given relieve and the soldiers were not allowed to harass them. Among the ones who brought their families here to seek assistance, they were taken care of in various aspects. For those who had lost their wives and children, they were given clothes and food in munificent amounts before they were sent off. Some of these people were very touched and impressed by this gesture, hence they brought their families to submit to the Wu sovereignty. In the vicinities, civilians also came to submit to Wu (2). Jiang Xia Gong Cao, Zhao Zhuo, Ge Yang's General Pei Sheng of the Wei Kingdom, as well as the leader of the barbarians, Mei Yi and others led their henchmen to submit to Lu Xun. Lu Xun then distributed all the riches to show solicitude.

(1) Pei Song Zhi's notes: I feel that Lu Xun was worried that when Sun Quan retreated, Wei could concentrate their forces on him. However, since he was able to make a false show of power to scare the enemy into taking no actions, in order to allow his navy to retreat safely without even the need to take precautions, why did he send his men to ambush a small county, causing a stampede among the civilians and kill themselves as a result? Capturing a mere thousand people is not sufficient to hurt Wei, and it is a cruel act that only leads to innocent casualties. In comparison to Zhuge Liang's army at Wei Bin, what a difference! Not only was the rule of war violated, the breaking of the laws would inevitably lead to dire consequences. Such actions cannot fool the people for more than three generations, do they not eventually lead to the Sun family's demise?

(2) Pei Song Zhi's notes: After creating great and unnecessary calamity and later returning the rightful belongings to the people, do you think that such meagre favours are sufficient to repay the great wrong done to them?
”太慢了。“
User avatar
Starscream
Decepticon Air Commander
 
Posts: 2146
Joined: Mon Jun 17, 2002 5:36 am
Location: Lost in space

Unread postby Starscream » Mon Nov 24, 2003 12:53 pm

The usual messages, inform me if there are any errors in the text. Thanks! :wink:

Continuing Lu Xun's biography:

Lu Shi(1), the Wei governor of Jiang Xia and also the person-in-charge of the army, often disturbed the Wu borders. He was however, always at loggerheads with Wen Xiu, the son of the veteran general Wen Pin. When Lu Xun got to know of this situation, he feigned a return letter to Lu Shi saying, "Upon receiving your letter, I know that you are sincere. I know that you and Wen Xiu has always been unable to get along, and unable to stand the other's presence, thus your consideration to submit to our office. I have secretly sent your letter to the imperial court, and will gather my men to welcome you. You sir, should hastily make preparations in secret now, with that, please inform us the exact time of your surrender." Lu Xun despatched a person to place the letter on the borders. When Lu Shi's soldiers picked up the letter and handed it over to him, he was horrified. Thus, he personally sent his wife and children back to Loyang. From then on, Lu Shi's peers and subordinates were unwilling to get close to him and subsequently, Lu Shi was removed of his ranks. (2)

In the sixth year of Jia He (A.D. 237), *Zhonglang Jiang* (crap! I forgot the translation for this rank!) Zhou Di requested for permission to recruit soldiers at Fan Yang commandery. Sun Quan asked Lu Xun for his opinion on this matter. Lu Xun felt that the Fan Yang civilians were prone to civil unrest and not law-abiding, hence recruitment should not take place as he feared enlisting bandits and robbers in the process as well. However, Zhou Di insisted on recruiting. As expected, Wu Ju and other Fan Yang civilians created trouble. They killed Zhou Di and conquered several counties' castles. At Yu Zhang and Hu Ling counties, trouble-makers still remained and they responded to Wu Ju's rebellion. When Lu Xun got news of this, he immediately set out to quell the rebels and successfully defeated them. Wu Ju and others surrendered. From them, Lu Xun selected some eight thousand elite troops and the three commanderies were thus pacified.

(1) Lu 逯 is pronounced the same way as 录.

(2) Your humble servant Songzhi feels that....(Lady Wu, fill in the rest for me, thanks! :lol: )
”太慢了。“
User avatar
Starscream
Decepticon Air Commander
 
Posts: 2146
Joined: Mon Jun 17, 2002 5:36 am
Location: Lost in space

Unread postby jiuwan » Mon Nov 24, 2003 6:22 pm

Cai Yan wrote: *Zhonglang Jiang* (crap! I forgot the translation for this rank


May I suggest this site that I made, <a href = "http://members.shaw.ca/jiuwan2/Ranks.htm"> Ranks</a>

I gathered a lot of the ranks and posted translations for it. I too sometimes forget the translations for some ranks, so I find it very useful to refer to sometimes. After all my brain is limited can can't memorize all the translations :wink:

中郎將 (zhong lang jiang) would be General of the Gentleman of the Household.
jiuwan
Marquis of Shun Ping
 
Posts: 541
Joined: Tue Jan 07, 2003 4:46 am

Unread postby Starscream » Tue Nov 25, 2003 3:15 am

The definition of Zhonglang Jiang:
職官名。秦時設置。西漢時,宿衛宮中的中郎分屬五官、左、右三署,各設中郎將統率之。東漢末增設東、南、西、北中郎將及虎賁、中郎將等。

Somehow, I'm reluctant to call "Zhonglang" as "the gentleman of the household" because the duties of Zhonglang seems to be that of an imperial guard, semi-advisor and also messager, while Zhonglang Jiang is the military rank (general or sub-general?) that commands over the Zhonglang. I wonder if "General of the Palace Guard" may be appropriate? Thanks for your help anyway! :wink:
”太慢了。“
User avatar
Starscream
Decepticon Air Commander
 
Posts: 2146
Joined: Mon Jun 17, 2002 5:36 am
Location: Lost in space

Unread postby jiuwan » Tue Nov 25, 2003 4:00 am

Cai Yan wrote:The definition of Zhonglang Jiang:
職官名。秦時設置。西漢時,宿衛宮中的中郎分屬五官、左、右三署,各設中郎將統率之。東漢末增設東、南、西、北中郎將及虎賁、中郎將等。


Is that from the book 三國職官表 by 洪飴孫? I'm still trying to get my hands on a copy of it.

Cai Yan wrote:Somehow, I'm reluctant to call "Zhonglang" as "the gentleman of the household" because the duties of Zhonglang seems to be that of an imperial guard, semi-advisor and also messager, while Zhonglang Jiang is the military rank (general or sub-general?) that commands over the Zhonglang. I wonder if "General of the Palace Guard" may be appropriate? Thanks for your help anyway! :wink:


Well I base most of my rank translations from two people: Lady Wu and Rafe De Crespigny. Here's what Rafe translated zhong lang jiang as:

zhong lang jiang-->General of the Gentlemen of the Household
wu guan zhong lang jiang-->General of the Gentlemen of the Household for All Purposes
shi Xiong nu zhong lang jiang-->General of the Gentlemen of the Household Emissary to the Xiongnu

So that's how I based my translations for the following that he didn't name:

fu jun zhong lang jiang-->General of the Gentleman of the Households that Comforts the Army
feng yi zhong lang jiang-->General of the Gentleman of the Households who Respects Righteousness
dong (nan, xi, bei) zhong lang jiang-->General of the Gentleman of the Households of the East (West, South, North respectively)
dian jun zhong lang jiang-->General of the Gentleman of the Households that sets Examples to the Army

I basically followed the pattern that Rafe used. That's the only source I have at the moment for ranks, until I get 三國職官表.

Sorry I couldn't be a help :cry:
jiuwan
Marquis of Shun Ping
 
Posts: 541
Joined: Tue Jan 07, 2003 4:46 am

Unread postby Starscream » Tue Nov 25, 2003 4:34 am

Nope, I got the definition from an online dictionary! :lol:

Anyway, I went to consult a book, 汉朝典章制度 by 苏俊良, so it says...
During the Western Han period, the rank "Lang" served as guards and was also in charge of carriages. There were four such titles: 议郎, 中郎, 侍郎 and 郎中. There were no fixed guide as to the number of "Lang" rank holders but it can amount to some thousand people. After Eastern Han, the "Lang" rank system became more complex. There were seven offices 郎署机构, of which 五官中郎将, 左中郎将, 右中郎将 were considered the three main offices known as 三署. Under each of the offices, that's where the Yi Lang, Zhong Lang, Shi Lang and Lang Zhong ranks stood. (p71)

Thus, the rank Zhonglang Jiang seems to imply that it is something like a leader of imperial guards, and not quite a general. Maybe I'll ask Lady Wu to clarify this. :wink:
”太慢了。“
User avatar
Starscream
Decepticon Air Commander
 
Posts: 2146
Joined: Mon Jun 17, 2002 5:36 am
Location: Lost in space

Unread postby Lady Wu » Fri Nov 28, 2003 8:39 am

Boy, Pei does have a thing against Lu Xun. At the bit where Lu Xun used that trick to get Lu Shi gone, Pei wrote:

Your servant, Songzhi, is of the opinion that it is a common thing for a (n enemy) general garrisoned at the border to create trouble. Even if Lu Shi is framed, his replacement would do the same thing. It's not the case that Lu Shi was intentionally malicious and a trouble-maker who would be a grave concern to security -- in fact, it was a trivial matter undeserving of Lu Xun's concern, let alone requiring him to use a trick in the matter! I cannot agree on [Chen Shou's] making this sound like a good thing.
"Whatever you do, don't fall off the bridge! It'll be a pain to try to get back up again." - Private, DW 8
User avatar
Lady Wu
There's no better state than Wu
There's no better state than Wu
 
Posts: 12840
Joined: Mon Aug 26, 2002 2:35 am
Location: Wu-ere else?

The Lu Xun saga continues...

Unread postby Lady Wu » Mon Dec 01, 2003 6:18 am

At that time, Lu Yi, Chief Editor of the Department of Documents (中書典校), was corrupt and abusive of his power. Lu Xun, and Pan Jun, Chief Minister of Rites (太常), were both very concerned with the situation, petitioning [Sun Quan to rectify the situation] to the point of tears. At some point after that, Sun Quan had Lu Yi put to death, reproaching himself greatly [for allowing Lu Yi's recklessness]. This is discussed in Sun Quan's biography.

Around that time too, Xie Yuan, Xie Gong, among others proposed various reforms aimed to increase state revenues (1). Sun Quan inquired Lu Xun for his opinion. Lu Xun gave the following analysis: "A state has at its foundation the common people, its strength built on the labour of the people, its wealth coming from the contribution of the people. Never is it the case that the populace can be wealthy when the state is poor, nor can the people be weak while the state is strong. Therefore, those in charge of the affairs of the state create peace by winning the support of the people, and create havoc by losing their support. Furthermore, it is difficult to make people dedicate their effort to the country if they cannot see what is in it for them. Thus in the Book of Odes, there is this exclamation: 'One who benefits the commoners, who benefits the people/He shall be shown great favours by Heaven.' I beg Your Majesty to show Your mercy to the people, and seek to make changes only when our resources are more abundant, after a few years' time.'

-----

(1) In Records of Kuaiji: Xie Yuan, styled Xiude, practised virtue at a young age. Though he had to till the ground and farm for a living, never did he show displeasure [of his poverty], nor did he become anxious easily. Thus his name became known in the land. He was later recommended as Filial and Incorrupt, and then eventually promoted to General who Establishes Might. Even when he was in the armed forces, he kept a lookout for talented men in the land. Luo Tong's son, Luo Xiu, was implicated in a scandal in his family. Everyone held him in suspicion, and he could not clear his name. After hearing about it, Xie Yuan sighed and said, "Gongxu's (Luo Tong's style name) too-early death is mourned by all of us. I've heard that his son is honourable and upright in his ambition and his conduct, but now he is covered by the shadow of an baseless scandal. I had hoped that all of you good sirs would judge correctly in his case; however, seeing that you each still have your doubts about him, I am disappointed." Eventually, Luo Xiu's name was cleared, and no fault was again attributed to him. Furthermore, he ended up being a famous and respected gentleman of the time, and that was all due to Xie Yuan's help.

In Annuals of Wu: Xie Gong was a talented debator, full of plans and strategems.

------

In the 7th year of Chiwu (AD 244), Lu Xun replaced Gu Yong as Prime Minister. The imperial decree issued for this ran thus:

"Though lacking in virtue and undeserving We are, by Heaven’s Mandate We ascended the throne. The earthly realm, though, is not yet unified, and criminals and evil-doers still fill the land. Night and day We tremble with worry, unable to take time even to rest.

But, you, sir, have been endowed with great intelligence and wisdom, and your brilliant virtues are apparent to all. Since you have been appointed as a general, you have upheld the honour of the country, defeating all her challengers. It is a fact that those who have performed extraordinary deeds will be glorified with boundless honour, and he who is full of martial and governmental talents will be given the burdens of the country. In the past, Yi Yin augmented the power of the Shang, and Lü Shang assisted the mighty Zhou; likewise, you, sir, should be bestowed with the responsibilities of both affairs internal and external. Today, I make you, sir, the Prime Minister, and command Fu Chang, Acting Grand Master of Ceremonies and Bearer of the Jie to bestow on you the seal and ribbon of your position. We entrust you, sir, to propagate the proper virtues, to accomplish monumental achievements, to bear the imperial orders and pacify the four corners of the world!

Be now the one above the Three Dukes, be now the one to admonish your peers. May you be respected, and may you always be heartened at your post.

Maintain the posts of Provincial Governor, Chief Commissioner and designated adminstrator of Wuchang as before."


---------------
Whew! Cai Yan, the rest is yours!!! Mwahahahahaha!!!!
"Whatever you do, don't fall off the bridge! It'll be a pain to try to get back up again." - Private, DW 8
User avatar
Lady Wu
There's no better state than Wu
There's no better state than Wu
 
Posts: 12840
Joined: Mon Aug 26, 2002 2:35 am
Location: Wu-ere else?

PreviousNext

Return to Kongming's Archives

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

Copyright © 2002–2008 Kongming’s Archives. All Rights Reserved